Forum:CT:Index Page Changes

Forums > Consensus track archive > CT:Index Page Changes
This page is an archive of a community-wide discussion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made in the Senate Hall or new Consensus track pages rather than here so that this page is preserved as a historic record.
The result of the debate was Votes 1 and 2: Support proposal; Vote 3: Support Option 1; Vote 4: No consensus. TanDivoInsignia-SenateMurders Anıl Şerifoğlu (talk) 02:25, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

Moving on from Forum:SH:Index Feedback Time, I'm hopeful these should be fairly straightforward four votes. (Cause we NEED more votes right now y'all)

Vote 1: Cleanup

Make the following changes to the Index policy. To re-summarize from the SH:

  1. We replaced the example with a trimmed version of C2-B5 to list a wider range of media types.
  2. (Formatting) Replaced some hyphens in the policy with em dashes for proper usage.
  3. Changed policy to format time stamps with colons (:) instead of periods (.), per US formatting standards.
  4. Changed policy to use en dashes for a range of pages/time stamps, per standard en dash usage.
  5. Removed duplicate links for release dates.

Support changes

  1. As proposer NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 15:50, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Imperators II(Talk) 15:59, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Bonzane10 Sabine Starbird (holonet) 16:27, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  4. As Dani's BESTEST FRIEND :D Fan26 (Talk) 16:28, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  5. Rsand 30 (talk) 16:39, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  6. Tommy-Macaroni (he/they) 16:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  7. —spookywillowwtalk 17:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  8. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 17:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  9. Sanathestarr (talk) 18:38, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  10. —SnowedLightning (they/she) 19:16, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  11. TanDivoInsignia-SenateMurders Anıl Şerifoğlu (talk) 19:37, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  12. OOM 224 (he/him) 21:53, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  13. Is this just making it match C4-DE formatting, or do I need to modify that? Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 21:55, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  14. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 22:21, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  15. Zed42 (talk) 22:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  16. Lewisr (talk) 19:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  17. Panther436 (talk) 05:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
  18. - Thannus (DFaceG) (he/him) (talk) 18:15, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
  19. Ayrehead02 (talk) 17:38, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

Oppose changes

Vote 2: Canon/Legends/OOU categories

Should index pages be categorized into continuity? Category:Canon index pages, Category:Legends index pages, and Category:Real-world index pages.

Support categories

  1. I just like this change but I'd get it if others don't see a use to it. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 15:50, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Imperators II(Talk) 15:59, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Bonzane10 Sabine Starbird (holonet) 16:28, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  4. I was waffling on this but considering that we do have different index pages for subjects with both canon and legends counterparts I suppose it makes sense Fan26 (Talk) 16:29, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  5. Rsand 30 (talk) 16:39, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  6. Tommy-Macaroni (he/they) 16:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  7. —spookywillowwtalk 17:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  8. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 17:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  9. Sanathestarr (talk) 18:39, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  10. —SnowedLightning (they/she) 19:16, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  11. TanDivoInsignia-SenateMurders Anıl Şerifoğlu (talk) 19:37, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  12. OOM 224 (he/him) 21:53, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  13. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 22:21, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  14. Zed42 (talk) 22:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  15. Lewisr (talk) 19:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  16. Panther436 (talk) 05:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
  17. - Thannus (DFaceG) (he/him) (talk) 18:15, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
  18. Ayrehead02 (talk) 21:08, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

Oppose categories

Quotes/Images

You can respectively find the current and proposed sections of Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Index page below, with edits depending on the results of the vote. The changes are written in bold.

Current version:

  • The index page contains a single list of all media from the article's appearances and sources sections listed in chronological release order with release date.

Vote 3: Allow quotes and images

If option 1 passes:

  • The index page contains a single list of all media from the article's appearances and sources sections listed in chronological release order with release date and without any accompanying quotes or images.

If option 2 passes:

  • The index page contains a single list of all media from the article's appearances and sources sections listed in chronological release order with release date and with accompanying quotes or images.

Option 1: Disallow all Quotes/Images

  1. This definitely needs to be added. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 15:50, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Fan26 (Talk) 16:31, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Rsand 30 (talk) 16:40, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  4. —spookywillowwtalk 17:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  5. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 17:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  6. Bonzane10 Sabine Starbird (holonet) 18:28, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  7. —SnowedLightning (they/she) 19:17, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  8. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 22:21, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  9. Zed42 (talk) 22:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  10. Lewisr (talk) 19:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  11. Panther436 (talk) 05:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
  12. - Thannus (DFaceG) (he/him) (talk) 18:15, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
  13. Ayrehead02 (talk) 21:08, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

Option 2: Allow Quotes/Images

Vote 4: Allow Header Quotes

If Vote 3 passes with "Disallow" and Vote 4 passes with support:

  • The index page contains a single list of all media from the article's appearances and sources sections listed in chronological release order with release date and without any accompanying quotes or images, save for a header quote.

Support

  1. I personally like them. Index:Nerko has an example of one in action. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 15:50, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Ehhhh, I don't care for it, but it doesn't hurt anything and allows for another quote that might not fit in the article. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 17:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Sanathestarr (talk) 18:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  4. —SnowedLightning (they/she) 19:17, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  5. I don't personally see myself using header quotes for index pages but I don't oppose them so long as they aren't required. - Thannus (DFaceG) (he/him) (talk) 00:23, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  6. Lewisr (talk) 19:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  7. OOM 224 (he/him) 15:29, 9 March 2024 (UTC)
  8. As long as a clarifying amendment comes in to say that it can't be a dupe quote from the article tbf, per below. I mean, common sense, but it'd be weird to have duplicating quotes just for the sake of it.—spookywillowwtalk 01:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
  9. Ayrehead02 (talk) 21:08, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

Oppose

  1. I'd rather see this kept strictly as an indexing tool and nothing else. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 22:21, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per Nano. Fan26 (Talk) 20:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Seems distracting and irrelevant to the article's purpose Panther436 (talk) 05:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)
  4. Rsand 30 (talk) 22:10, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Comments

  • What about if the quote(s)/image(s) can serve to further narrow down where a particular subject is featured? (Especially pertinent for indirect mentions.) Imperators II(Talk) 16:01, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
    • It could definitely be useful for hard-to-access quotes too. For something like Dune-rat, if I chose to use the comic's usage of dune-rat for the article's header quote, the index could house the Survivor quote. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 16:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
      • My point is more, restricting it to just the header quote might potentially be a bit too restrictive in these situations—even though personally I don't think it'd make sense to have quotes on index pages in other cases just for the sake of having them. Imperators II(Talk) 16:10, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
        • I wouldn't be opposed to policy allowing relevant quotes/images, but I struggle to think of how to codify that. Also, do you perhaps have an example of a useful case? They're allowed per policy at the moment if you want to mock one up. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 16:15, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
          • The numerous cases where we derive a celestial body being terrestrial from the usage of the preposition "on" come to mind. Imperators II(Talk) 16:28, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
          • Could we potentially do something similar to social media/web citation templates, where a relevant quote is presented alongside the source listing? May not work (or be needed) when there are numerous quotes in one source, but for indirect mentions and such it might be useful. Zed42 (talk) 21:19, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
            • Isn't the listing of the relevant page(s) next to the document sufficient enough for this purpose? NanoLuukeCloning Facility 22:21, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
              • That's true, but it was more for further clarity in the case of indirect mentions or situations where details are derived from certain wording, like mentioned above. I don't think that having quotes just for the sake of it is strictly necessary. Zed42 (talk) 22:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  • Bit on the fence about it. With the current wording, technically, the quote used as a header quote could technically also be used on the article; resulting in a duplicate quote usage. If it specified ex. (save for a header quote not used on the article). might be more inclined to allow for it.—spookywillowwtalk 21:26, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
    • I think the image portion will end up going through SH/CT again. When that occurs I'll add a fix for that, but until then, assuming the quote passes, I'll just trust people to not duplicate. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 23:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  • I think images might be useful for index especially to point out a specific subject in crowded scenes. However, I do think that we could incorporate images without actually putting any directly on the page which could bloat it. I think the system we have currently for archival files and social media screenshots can be implemented. This sounds clearer in my head. Bonzane10 Sabine Starbird (holonet) 23:38, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
    • Basically, we just link the files and have a dedicated page for storing those images to avoid deletion, similar to the social media screenshots we have. Bonzane10 Sabine Starbird (holonet) 23:45, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
  • Just noticed something, in the C2-B5 example, the databank entry is listed with a date in the middle of the list. I've noticed most Index pages just have databank entries as "Current:", at the end of the list, making them in line with the actual page's sources list and the LG. Wouldn't that make more sense to do here, since most databank entries don't have a source to confirm when they were put up. Tommy-Macaroni (he/they) 18:25, 24 March 2024 (UTC)
    • It makes sense to list Databank entries at the end since they are subject to modification at any time, but I personally think noting the release dates of DB entries (if applicable) would fit the scope of the index pages. TanDivoInsignia-SenateMurders Anıl Şerifoğlu (talk) 23:43, 24 March 2024 (UTC)