Forum:CT:Infobox image galleries

Forums > Consensus track archive > CT:Infobox image galleries
This page is an archive of a community-wide discussion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made in the Senate Hall or new Consensus track pages rather than here so that this page is preserved as a historic record.
The result of the debate was support, and add new hardcoded fields. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 11:07, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

At long last! Please see Forum:SH:Infobox image galleries previous discussions on the topic, which has also been through a lot of back-and-forth through Discord for about three years. Let's get straight to it. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 10:14, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

Main vote

1) Add the following text under Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Main image as a subsection titled "Infobox galleries" and 2) treat the secondary vote as a plurality vote with each option requiring a simple majority to determine how infobox galleries would work in terms of coding—the secondary vote will require at least 10 votes in total per the standard WP:CON rules, and, failing that, the default option will be option 2, for standard gallery tags, since there would be no change to the infobox template code. Linked here are some examples for visual reference only; we can debate the exact image usage afterward.

A gallery may be used in the "image" field of an article's infobox if the subject has multiple distinct appearances. They should be used as sparingly as possible and are restricted to character, organization, and location articles.

Infobox galleries must abide by the following general rules:

  1. The first image of the gallery is the main image, which should not be reused in the article body. After the main image, the rest of the gallery should be ordered by in-universe chronology.
  2. Images should be of the same dimension ratios whenever possible to prevent the infobox from shifting in length.
  3. Infobox gallery usage and selection is subject to consensus votes in the case of a dispute.

Infobox galleries on character articles: may contain a maximum of three images. No two images can be from the same piece of media or have the same person portraying the character unless there is at least 10 years' age difference or major visible differences, including between a character's unmasked and masked appearances if either one is particularly significant to the character, such as clone troopers' personalized helmets.

Infobox galleries on organization articles: may contain a maximum of two images to feature the logo and the members. The organization logo should be the main image.

Infobox galleries on location articles: may contain a maximum of two images if significant visible differences are present, such as the intact and fractured versions of Jedha.

ABY/BBY dates are preferred as image tab titles to reduce clutter (example: "9 ABY" and "19 BBY" for Ahsoka Tano). However, in certain cases it may be more precise to label a subject's distinct states instead (example: "Logo" and "Members" for Clone Force 99's logo and group picture; "Intact and "Fractured" for Jedha before and after its partial destruction; "Tenebrae," "Vitiate," and "Valkorion" for Tenebrae's three incarnations; "Face" and "Helmet" for Fives with an uncovered face and with his helmet on; "Clawdite" and "Human" for the shapeshifting Zam Wesell). When using the two methods in combination, maintain consistency by making use of parantheses (example: "1 BBY," "19 BBY," and "19 BBY (helmet)" for Rex).

Support

  1. This could not have been possible without extensive discussion between many, many Wookieepedians, so thank you all for making this happen. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 10:14, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. Bonzane10 Bonzane10-Sig 10:28, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. 01miki10 Open comlink 10:31, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Mor9347 ForPipadaLogo-UserImage (Talk) 10:37, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Raptorfe10 (talk) 11:53, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  6. I have Spooky on retainer to ensure I don't abuse this. NBDani TeamFireballLogo-Collider(they/them)Yeager's Repairs 12:03, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  7. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 12:08, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  8. See comments - JMAS Jolly Trooper Hey, it's me! 14:33, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  9. Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 15:16, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  10. —spookywillowwtalk 15:59, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  11. Ayrehead02 (talk) 16:34, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  12. I didn't think I would support this, but I have appraised it and come to appreciate its potential utility, so long as it is not overused to absurdity. I think this is a good change, actually, and we are capable of implementing it in a way that does not take away from the wikian professionalism and rigid quality which we pride ourselves on. Fan26 (Talk) 16:36, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  13. CometSmudge (talk) 16:54, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  14. Long have I waited... Wok142 (talk) 19:16, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  15. ThrawnChiss7 Mitth symbol Assembly Cupola 19:19, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  16. Imperators II(Talk) 20:43, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  17. Would prefer a clause spelling out that individual characters can be CT'd to allow up to 5 images, but that can be changed later. Let's get the ball rolling now. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 00:34, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
  18. Tommy-Macaroni (he/they) 10:16, 10 December 2024 (UTC)
  19. Zed42 Wolfpack emblem (talk) 10:32, 12 December 2024 (UTC)
  20. — Commandant Bhatoa (talk) 10:58, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

Oppose

Secondary vote: formatting

Within the infobox, we have two options for formatting. Both have their pros and cons, so I'll leave this for the community at large to decide. Most other wikis use the standard gallery tags (option 2) but we can also make hardcoded fields work with a hard limit on three images max (option 1). Both options appear the same on the page for the end-user, so this simply impacts functionality and the editing interface.

We can either build the gallery code into it, seen in action here with the code looking like this: 

{{Character
|type=
|image=File:AhsokaTano-AG.png
|image2=File:Ahsoka_Tano_Rebels_Profile.png
|image3=File:Ahsoka_Tano_TWJ.png
|option1=9 ABY
|option2=3 BBY
|option3=19 BBY
|name=Ahsoka Tano
…

…or use standard wikicode gallery tags, seen in action here, with the code looking like this: 

{{Character
|type=
|image=<gallery>
File:AhsokaTano-AG.png|9 ABY
File:Ahsoka_Tano_Rebels_Profile.png|3 BBY
File:Ahsoka_Tano_TWJ.png|19 BBY
</gallery>
|name=Ahsoka Tano
|homeworld=[[Shili]] {{C|raised on [[Coruscant]]}}
…

Add new hardcoded fields

  1. More distinct and easier for editors to know ab the feature. Bonzane10 Bonzane10-Sig 10:29, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. Raptorfe10 (talk) 11:54, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. Though we can generate glaring errors when people (inevitably) try to cram 4-5+ images into popular characters' boxes, it still can't be prevented. Unless someone is an active Wookian, they probably aren't going to be aware of the finer points of policy. Most editors (statistically, says Fandom) make their first edit on mobile, where the generated errors aren't visible (since this would be using the same logic as the missing infobox parameter) so the editor would walk away thinking everything's fine, only to be re-reverted in a constant cycle of either the same person or new people on other pages. With hardcoded fields, we can keep the gallery tag abusefilter that exists currently in place. My other home wiki has been using the cloned /deep structure for infoboxes for many years now; it was originally created by our then-Wiki Representative and hasn't broken since, so (re: per comments below) I have confidence that it realistically shouldn't be breaking easily.—spookywillowwtalk 15:59, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Believe in the code. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 16:11, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. VICTORY IS MINE! Module:InfoboxGallery Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 16:17, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  6. Ayrehead02 (talk) 16:34, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  7. I don't believe in the code. I also don't believe in Cade. I just believe in whatever makes life easier. Those two things just happen to result in the latter today. :P Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 16:49, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  8. CometSmudge (talk) 16:54, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  9. Wok142 (talk) 19:16, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  10. ThrawnChiss7 Mitth symbol Assembly Cupola 19:19, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  11. Imperators II(Talk) 20:43, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  12. JMAS Jolly Trooper Hey, it's me! 23:38, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  13. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 19:05, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
  14. Tommy-Macaroni (he/they) 10:16, 10 December 2024 (UTC)
  15. Zed42 Wolfpack emblem (talk) 10:32, 12 December 2024 (UTC)
  16. — Commandant Bhatoa (talk) 10:58, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

Use standard gallery tags

  1. 01miki10 Open comlink 10:31, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

Discuss

  • Small issue with "No two images can be from the same piece of media" for characters. To me, this would mean we cannot put a gallery in Din Djarin because any two images we have of him are going to be from the same media. - JMAS Jolly Trooper Hey, it's me! 14:37, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
    • That's a good point. It's intended to put a restriction on having too many images, but since we've set a hard numerical limit we might not need it. It does get in the way, I agree, but for now I guess we can still say that the images of Mando are technically from different sources. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 17:39, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  • So, I'm torn. On the one hand, I like having them as distinct fields, but it does introduce some funky nesting requirements where we have to recreate the entire infobox template and pass the entire thing down into its deep clone, and could result in some issues down the line. Conversely, the native gallery tags work right out of the box, but it's inherently uncontrollable; I will be generating big red warning texts if Module:InfoboxParamCheck detects more than 3 files in the image field, but it doesn't stop the tags being added into any infobox like that. Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 15:52, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
    • UPDATE: I have successfully gotten it to work using a Lua module to generate the gallery tags without any need for nesting templates, so there's no longer any reason to not use the hardcoded parameters.
  • The proposal says a maximum of three images for character articles, but the workbench example uses Anakin Skywalker, a prime example of a character that could benefit from raising that to 5 images. I think it's best we have TPM, TCW, ROTS, ANH, Force Ghost, and Ahsoka versions of Anakin. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 16:45, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
    • I've heard some people raise concern over potential bloat, and the hardcoded template fields do mean that we're restricted to three images max. We could definitely look into setting an individual exception for Anakin, but I'd say most characters are better off with the maximum limit of three. OOM 224 (he/him/they) 17:39, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
      • I'd be ok with a CT vote requirement for a character to get more than 3 images. Master FredceriqueCommerce Guild(talk) (he/him) 17:49, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
        • Yea Anakin is probably the only exception and that can be individually treated through CT. Wok142 (talk) 19:07, 6 December 2024 (UTC)
  • I would also like this amended to be used on actor pages, Main image portray their real world self (if available), and then the roles they've played. Now the vast majority of actors would only require 2, maybe 3. But a fair few voice actors have portrayed many characters. And while this should be restricted to only major characters they've voiced, that could still be more than 3 for some actors. And Silas Carson would also require 5 images. - JMAS Jolly Trooper Hey, it's me! 00:45, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
    • I like this idea, but might be worth a preliminary discussion though. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 19:11, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
    • Mainly re: that agreed on a SH first; mainly because probably needs some specific wording defining what 'major characters' is defined as since otherwise could be listing far too many (for the infobox to reasonably handle without having a few rows of tabs).—spookywillowwtalk 19:14, 7 December 2024 (UTC)