Forum:CT:Separate discussion area for Star Wars universe

Forums > Consensus track archive > CT:Separate discussion area for Star Wars universe


This page is an archive of a community-wide discussion. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made in the Senate Hall or new Consensus Track pages rather than here so that this page is preserved as a historic record.
The result of the debate was to not create a separate discussion area for Star Wars universe.–SentryTalk 00:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


Recently, we had tens of users using our Forum:Senate Hall as a place to discuss about the Star Wars Universe. This is getting out of control and no matter how many warnings we post on their talk pages and the Senate Hall itself, more keep doing it. Well, User:Darth Anarcus suggested creating a separate area, identical in structure to the Senate Hall, but for dicussing ONLY about the Star Wars universe?

We are aware about the existence of many Star Wars forums on the World Wide Web though maybe people post their questions here because they think we are the most reliable people for asking information about the Star Wars universe. They have to make sure their knowledge is correct or that all of the information in the Wiki is correct, which is no easy task. So what do you think. Then we won't have to waste so much time scolding them for posting such questions on the Senate Hall. However I hope people like that reactionist firebrand User:StarShadow do not fill this forum with criticisim. MyNz 2:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

For

  1. MyNz 4:06, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  2. jSarek 04:32, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  3. .... 10:03, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  4. Darth Culator (Talk) 12:46, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  5. Imp 20:35, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  6. For as long as it is limited as described. Fnlayson 00:28, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
  7. Since the only way to stop newbies from asking general questions that I can come up with would be putting bigger and angrier warnings on the Senate Hall, shouting repeatedly at inexperienced users, and generally behaving in increasingly obnoxious ways, I'm willing to consider something like this. —Silly Dan (talk) 03:35, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Against

  1. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 03:13, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  2. SentryTalk 03:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  3. Ozzel 04:45, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  4. SFH 04:48, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  5. Per Atarumaster88. Adamwankenobi 04:53, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  6. If you want to talk Star Wars, there are all kinds of other places to do it. If you want a question answered, a Wookieepedia forum won't be able to answer it any better than Wookieepedia articles can. Havac 14:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  7. Were not a forum anymore than we are a place for users to post fanon...which happens just as much 'sigh' Jedi Dude 15:17, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  8. - breathesgelatinTalk 04:53, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  9. Kwenn 20:41, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  10. This has bad idea written all over it. Grand Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) Imperial Emblem 01:16, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
  11. Jaina Solo(Goddess Stuff) 01:21, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
  12. IMO the MediaWiki software is not really suited for large-scale discussions. --Craven 10:58, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
  13. There are plenty of sites for this already. VT-16 14:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
  14. Per Atarumaster88, but weak support —Mirlen 04:31, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
  15. I need a name (Complain here) 23:44, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
  16. There's always the IRC channel if they really have to talk about it --Xwing328(Talk) 06:27, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
  17. That's what TFN is for. - Sikon 11:30, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Comments

  • Lets get the discussion rolling. MyNz 4:07, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  • I personally do not think we should do this, because
  1. We are not here to discuss the Star Wars universe in general, but to archive and document it (WP:NOT)
  2. We should not want to play host to various arguments, complaints, and debates that pop-up- i.e. the number of clones, the armament of Star Destroyers, the gender of the Exile, Twi'lek/human relations, and who knows what else.
  3. We are NOT an authoritative source. Don't get me wrong- we are vastly superior to the Databank, and have much more information per topic than CUSWE. However, we only record canon and can't authoritatively answer some questions as well as luminaries such as Leland Chee, Dan Wallace, or Abel Pena can.
  4. There are too many "warring factions" in the Star Wars universe- we are an encyclopedia and should try to be neutral, not biased towards/against NJO-haters, original trilogyists, Fandalorians, Saxtonites, and whatever groups exist out there.
  5. An opportunity to ask whatever one wants is a very large temptation for people to get into trolling.
  6. It distracts from our overall purpose to improve our own Wiki.

I can see some merit in the idea, but it could very easily spiral out of control and we would mostly likely have to make more admins just to monitor this new proposed section- our current ones do a pretty good job as it is, but adding this section would be an extra burden. For additional input, I suggest you bring it up at the upcoming Mofference if this is not resolved by then. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 03:13, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

  • Several well established Star Wars discussion forums already exist and since the wiki format really does not lend itself to such a use, I suggest we just direct users to elsewhere as we have always done.–SentryTalk 03:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
  • Some of my thoughts on the matter: 1) We've been trying to get users to use other locations, but, as was said, no matter how big we make the warnings, it doesn't work. 2) There may be other discussion forums online, but currently we're the only place (AFAIK) that allows for quick, anonymous posting. Everyplace else requires registration. 3) The various fandom arguments are already here, spread out over our talk pages and existing forums. Adding this will change nothing. 4) Allowing people a place to speak their minds, rather than us incessantly biting the newbs when they try and talk in the Senate Hall, is more likely to encourage them to stick around and positively contribute. jSarek 04:32, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
    • JSarek hit the nail right on the head. And anyway, here at Wookiepedia, we have become a community (though I personally haven't been here that long), and we are more close knit than say, Wikipedia, and since we all have a common interest, I think that out own discussion section would be excellent. Who knows, with time, and a more effective form of Wookienews, we might be able to rival Theforce.net........ 10:05, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
    • Were not a forum..Jedi Dude 15:16, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
      • Yea we're. I think it'd be better to partner with an existing forum that try to take that on ourselves. -Fnlayson 15:52, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

jSarek's points are all good, and I'd like to add that having our own general discussion forums will, in theory, keep the biases of certain persons and organizations from influencing discussions here. Unlike TF.n and SW.com, nobody here is going to get banned for presenting a perfectly reasonable and well-formed argument about why certain authors or certain facts are incorrect just because their ideas are devastating to the party line. -- Darth Culator (Talk) 12:46, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

  • I'm at a crossroads on this decision. Both points are valid and are backed by several advantages. My question is, if we enact this new section, what occurs when things suddenly become violent and divided? Do we deal with them in the same manner as the article talk pages or when intervening in an edit war -or- does this area have completely different rules? I must state however that we need to reduce the amount of 'duh' questions on here like about how to edit by making sure our new Wookieepedians know where the FAQ is and know how to use it, to then become good contributors. -- Riffsyphon1024 17:01, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  • I'm for this. I would be very interested in helping administrate the proposed forums, I have in fact ran several forums in the past. I suggest we use the lightweight and sweet-looking Vanilla forums. We could easily modify it to look Wookieepedia-ish. Maybe we could host the forums at wookieepedia.com, with Whitey's blessing? --Imp 20:35, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
  • We've already got a problem with users signing up solely to work on their user pages at the expense of the Wookiee's content, and this would only serve to attract people wanting questions answered, without contributing anything. There's already a host of other sites, and users on TF.N reguarly direct people here if they want info on a particular aspect of the saga - Kwenn 20:41, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
    • ...and we've got talk pages clogged up with mindless opinionated questions. TF.N is nice and all, but quite frankly, it's homongonised. You can't say "poo" without getting banned. .... 00:21, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
      • Frankly, I don't think we should create an environment that fosters people to say whatever they want and have discussions. Does anyone remember this? There are other examples of course. My point is that we have enough problems with people adding their own inflammatory opinions here while doing nothing to help the wiki. We would need more administrators and I still think TF.N and SW.C are better for answering general questions about the Star Wars Universe, particularly SW.C since they have this guy working for them who can answer questions authoritatively if he so chooses. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 04:25, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
  • I'l say it again, were not a forum, and all we need it a few people to come and start voicing their opinions and start off another fight. Jedi Dude 11:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
    • I'm not gonna vote in this, because i dont know which side to choose. But I will say this, too many users have ignored our warnings that they should go to other websites to talk about this sort of thing,. Usually they just keep posting. So I guess we could do something like this, but we would need more admins to constantly monitor the area and it could easily turn into a big fight between users. This should be something brought up at our next Mofference. Roron Corobb 19:12, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
      • I just had an idea, how about not having a place where fans discuss who is more powerful, the jedi exile should be male, etc.. But a place where they can ask general questions, not express personal opinions about something, but where they can ask a question and have it quickly answered by one of us. Roron Corobb 19:27, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
        • I don't think there are too many questions they can ask that aren't in our articles. And the whole "no opinionated questions" thing is next to impossible to enforce. Part of the reason those users keep posting whatever they want is because the Senate Hall and various talk pages are not well monitored by the admins- no discredit towards them, but that's a lot to cover. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 00:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
  • Then perhaps more admins are needed. Roron Corobb 21:06, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
    • Well, Lt.NOWIS was just approved not long ago and Sentry is well on his way. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 23:42, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
      • Since we get heaps of new users and anons asking questions in the Senate, why don't we just post a list of Users that are willing to answer their questions without disrupting the Senate? .... 23:56, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
    • Sounds good, I would do it. Roron Corobb 01:09, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
  • The only way I would support this is if watching the discussion area was added to the admin's to-do list and maybe we should consider adding more admins to help control this. Policy would also need to be written and readily displayed to exactly what type of questions could be asked and how inflammatory questions would be handled. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 06:42, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Inflammatory questions would be met with a warning, and if not heeded, a succinct, temporary ban. I would put myself up...I'm more than willing to answer questions. Just not in the senate. .... 06:52, 2 November 2006 (UTC)


The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.