Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Calo Nord

< Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations
The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was successful. Please do not modify it.

Calo Nord

  • Nominated by: Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:17, July 10, 2009 (UTC)
  • Nomination comments: Might as well nom this, too…

(5 Inqs/5 Users/10 Total)

Support

  1. LordDeathRay (My Sith Holocron) 01:27, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
  2. Inqvote Pre-nom reviewed.—Tommy9281 Dark side Master SWGTCG (Talk) 14:16, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
  3. Great article. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 03:04, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
  4. Inqvote -- —Harrar (Cut the comm chatter) 10:07, October 7, 2009 (UTC)
  5. NayayenOld Republic military symbol(talk) 20:48, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
  6. Inqvote CC7567 (talk) 05:32, December 1, 2009 (UTC)
  7. LtNOWIS 18:48, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
  8. Inqvote Chack Jadson (Talk) 22:09, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
  9. Looks good.--Loneshark1138 Koensayr (Comlink) 14:34, January 18, 2009 (UTC)
  10. Inqvote I guess. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 00:17, March 1, 2010 (UTC)

Object

  1. NaruHina
    • Context on the Mando Wars and the Jedi Civil War
      • I took out the Mandalorian Wars part, so far there is no record of his being active during that time, just the Jedi Civil War. Can't just assume that he was without any proof. Context for the JCW and Revan and Malak is there.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "On his sixteenth birthday, he killed his slave masters, and then tracked down and murdered his mother and father, who had sold him into slavery when he was a boy." Triple "and." (partially my fault, sorry :P)
    • "amnesiac former Sith Lord Revan" This either needs context or needs to be changed to something like "a Galactic Republic soldier." Revan was not Revan at this point, when his mind was changed, he became a different person and, at this point in continuity, his past as a Sith Lord is irrelevant.
      • True, but the context about his former life is relevant, since it establishes why Malak would send both Nord and Bandon after him and Shan.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Good point.
    • "he butchered his slave masters" I know this is nitpicky but does the Prima Guide specifically say "butchered."
      • After reading the Databank entry, I see that it confirms this. The statement should be sourced to there if it does not appear in the Prima guide.
        • Yes, it does. I got it from the guide.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "After watching Nord kill three Black Vulkars for disturbing him" I don't remember, were the three specified as Vulkars?
      • If Revan converses immediately after Nord kills the thugs, Revan says "I saw how you mopped up those Vulkars"…--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Nord and Kang—who themselves tried to make it to the ship—caught Revan and his companions trying to steal the ship." Double "and"
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
        • There's nothing particularly wrong with using two ands in one sentence like that. -- AdmirableAckbar (Talk) 20:01, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
          • I know. Grammatically it was fine but it still read a bit off. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 05:56, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Kang perished in the fighting and Revan, Shan, and Onasi boarded the Ebon Hawk, picked up the rest of their companions, and fled Taris." Double "and"
    • "When Nord had sufficiently recovered, he had a private audience with Darth Malak aboard the Leviathan and, along with Admiral Karath, told the Sith Lord that Shan had escaped Taris' destruction with the help of Onasi." "Along with Admiral Karath is awkward here. Is there a source that states Nord informed him of Revan being alive here? Also, I don't think Calo and Karath told Malak this together.
      • Took care of "along with", Karath had all the other soldiers leave the bridge before they told Malak. "Lord Malak, forgive me. There is something else. May we have a private audience away from the ears of the common soldiers? "I trust you are not wasting my time, Admiral Karath." "I promise you will be very interested in what Calo has to tell you about Bastila's other companions, Lord Malak".--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Nord then set out to find Revan and his companions. After Taris' destruction, Revan had become a Padawan to be retrained in the Jedi ways at the Jedi Enclave" "Retrained" is odd here because it hasn't been made clear that Revan forgot his training, didn't finish training, or that he was trained by Jedi at all before this. Reword.
      • I believe the context had been established.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "When Revan asked Nord if they could work out a deal so as to avoid fighting, Nord told him that he was not in it for the credits; rather, he had a reputation to protect." I'm not sure that you can say that he chose a certain conversation option in the body of the article (unless its the only option, of course).
      • The other dialogue options are aggressive, and un-Jedi like, which I thought went against Wookiepedia policy of 100% light-side choices unless otherwise stated by another source. These are the other options: "You traveled a long way just to die, Calo!" and, "You think I got lucky last time? Okay, let's do it again!".--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
        • OK.
    • "With that, Nord attacked Revan, but he and his minions were killed by the redeemed Jedi and his companions" Another mention of his time as a Sith Lord, nothing has been mentioned of anything Revan did that would need penance.
      • Context has been established.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:42, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Shortly after Nord's death, Admiral Karath informed Darth Malak of Nord's failure. Malak told Karath that the penalty for failure was death, but that the failure was Nord's." This is slightly confusing. Why would Malak have to tell Karath that the failure was Nord's?
    • In the P&T, when talking about how he knows Basic, I think you could also say that he could comprehend the language(s) of those three aliens who confronted him in the bar.
    • "used a prototype energy shield of Verpine design for extra protection during battle." A link to the specific energy shield would be beneficial if it is stated. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 07:25, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Wasn't Carth a captain, not a commander? NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 20:47, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
      • The Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide lists him as having been a commander during the Jedi Civil War, as this is the latest canon, it's what we have to go by.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 23:31, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
  2. Naru, Part Deux
    • "However, Nord was caught under falling debris from the hangar, allowing the group to kill Kang" Wasn't Kang already dead?
      • Yes, he was, thanks for pointing this out. Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:02, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Also, there should probably be a mention of how the events in the hanger differ if Revan brought a sword or a blaster.
      • Huh?
        • The scene plays out a bit differently depending on whether Revan brought a blaster or a sword into the hanger when he fights Nord and Kang. I don't remember if the change had anything specificly to do with how Calo reacted but its something to look into for a Bts note. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 22:42, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
          • I just played it three times over with all three armed with blasters, then swords, and then fists and got exactly the same dialogue every time. Then out of curiosity, I checked the dialogue file itself (tar08_davik082.dlg) and there are no alternate dialogue paths. I honestly don't know where you got this idea. -- Darth Culator (Talk) 04:50, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
            • Quite odd. I remember playing a difference and then reading it again later but I dunno. It probably wasn't important anyway. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 05:06, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "During his time as a slave, he learned to be ruthless and cold-hearted, so when he turned sixteen years of age, he butchered his slave masters and then murdered his parents." That he tracked down and killed his parents is only in the intro. Also a double "and"
    • "Aboard his flagship Leviathan, Darth Malak came to the conclusion that the search for Shan was taking too long and ordered the Sith Admiral Saul Karath to have the Sith fleet destroy Taris in order to kill the Jedi. After Revan and his companions disabled the hangar bay's security systems in Kang's estate, they attempted to make it to the Ebon Hawk." It sortof jumps here from the order to their escape. Why are they trying to leave the planet? NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 22:27, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
      • Taken care of. Context provided in second paragraph.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:49, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Escape from what? The Sith? Why would they need the Ebon Hawk specifically? There should be a small mention that it possessed the codes neccisary to bypass the Sith blockade somewhere. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 22:42, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
          • Please take a look at the article.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 23:10, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
            • Objection(s) overridden by Inquisitorius 19:40, December 13, 2009 (UTC)
  3. Harrar
    • When the Sith began bombarding Taris, Nord and Kang tried to kill Shan, an amnesiac soldier, actually Revan; the Republic commander Carth Onasi, and the Mandalorian Canderous Ordo, when they tried to steal Kang's flagship, the Ebon Hawk. There are many things wrong with the sentence; you can't have two "whens", your semi-colon and comma use are messed up, the Revan information is jarring, the Ebon Hawk is not a flagship, they confront them in the hangar rather than set out to kill them...etc.
      • One of the "whens" is omitted. It now reads "during their attempt to steal"… I'm changing "flagship" to "freighter", but it should be noted that in-game, both Hudrow, Kang's pilot, and Ordo refer to the ship as "Davik's flagship.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:01, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
    • "The former Dark Lord Revan—who was betrayed by Malak...[text]...Revan watched Nord kill two Rodians so that he could collect the bounties on their heads." - this entire section is written from Revan's point of view, but this is Nord's biography. Please correct this.
    • In fact, the entire Taris section is oriented towards Revan's activities. You need to re-structure this so it relates to Nord.
      • Take a look at it, might need to do more work at it, though.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:19, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
    • I find the way you repeat language used in the section quotations very distracting. For example: Sorry, I'm not in this for the credits. You're the only ones who've ever gotten away from me—I've got a rep to protect! Nord told him that he was not in it for the credits; rather, he had a reputation to protect. I'm sure you can paraphrase the information in a better fashion.
      • The whole thing about Nord citing his damaged reputation and all is not really important, so I removed it. Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:58, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
    • While it's great to see key characters from KotOR getting FAed, I feel that the general apathy towards reviewing these nominations should be considered by nominators. I know that it's my role to read through these articles, but they tend to repeat the same information, in the same style, from vaguely different perspectives. Game mechanics are always very obvious, and when dialogue is simply converted into indirect speech with no regard for the dullness of the repetition, it becomes a little tiresome. -- —Harrar (Cut the comm chatter) 12:04, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
      • I understand your concerns, but I don't feel there is anything I, or anyone, can do about that. As you know, there is simply not enough info beyond the game on characters such as Nord or Bandon. They were created by BioWare merely as boss characters, Hopefully, the comic series will feature these, and other, characters in the future. In the future, I'll try to be careful about converting dialogue into indirect speech. Thank you for the review.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:58, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
        • Thanks, Kasra, for addressing these points so quickly and effectively. My apologies for the nature of my comments. -- —Harrar (Cut the comm chatter) 10:07, October 7, 2009 (UTC)
  4. Having finally gotten those images for it, I only have one issue. In the Bts, "...Nord explains to Revan how he managed to reach the underwater station." Can you add a sentence or two to explain to us how he reached Hrakert? The rest of it is great. NayayenOld Republic military symbol(talk) 18:01, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
  5. Attack of the Clone
    • Is the fact that he was "hired" really an affiliation to those three groups in the infobox? Bribing with credits ≠ belief in a cause.
      • No, removed. Something I wanted to ask you about. Cad Bane's infobox says that his allegiance laid in the highest bidder. The Databank's entry on Nord says a similar thing, as you'll find in the P&T section. Could I add this to Nord's infobox?--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
        • If a source explicitly states so, then no, I do not see why you should contradict an official source. However, the fact remains that you still haven't properly fixed his allegiances; by removing the "hired," it's even less factually correct than it was before. CC7567 (talk) 16:21, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
          • Here's what the Databank says: "Calo knew no allegiance other than to hard credits or the thrill of the hunt." He was hired by these groups, so shouldn't he be technically be affiliated with them? Whether he actually believed in each group's cause is irrelevant, isn't it?--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 15:43, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
            • No, it is relevant. If he "knew no allegiance other than to hard credits or the thrill of the hunt", prose aside, you're basically ignoring an official source by saying otherwise. If he's working for a group and getting paid, the only thing that can be assumed is that he's working because he's getting paid. You're welcome to add the three groups in as affiliations if you can find a source that explicitly states that he was affiliated to them aside from credits. I'm going to cite this discussion to help you understand this problem better. CC7567 (talk) 18:32, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
              • Alright, considering I've got it in the P&T that his ultimate loyalty was to whoever offered the most credits, I put down "Highest bidder" in his allegiances. Thank you for the link to the discussion on that.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 20:02, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
    • Please watch your "unknowns". I've removed them, but these have close to no place in IU articles, as you should know by now.
      • Forgot that these were in here, sorry.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
    • Are you absolutely certain that all of the details in the third paragraph of Battle of Taris are directly relevant to Nord? I'm under the impression that they can be shortened.
      • I am not so sure. It gives context on wehy Revan infiltrated Kang's estate, how, and with who.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
        • It's the little details that keep on adding up. Is the Tarisian Season Opener really necessary? Is the fact that Ordo approached Revan absolutely necessary when you can simply say that Revan teamed up with him and stole the Sith codes? Also, the "After Ordo" sentences that start in the exact same manner are getting rather tiresome; please fix this somehow. CC7567 (talk) 03:57, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
    • Same issue in the first paragraph of the "Death" section. You first say that Nord was granted a "private audience" with Malak, but don't introduce him until several sentences later, which can be fixed by rewriting it more around Nord.
      • Please try it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
        • Please read what I've edited it to so that you get an idea of what I'm expecting. However, you also need to clarify how Nord can be granted a "private audience" with Malak when Karath is still present. CC7567 (talk) 03:57, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
          • Got it. Looked at the dialogue files, he and Karath had a private audience with Malak after Karath introduced Malak to Nord. Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 15:43, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
    • "The leaders of the secret bounty hunter guild known as the GenoHaradan considered admitting Nord in their organization, although he had not yet proven himself worthy of joining. However, due to his end at Revan's hands, the secret society's overseers decided to instead approach Revan with an invitation to join the GenoHaradan." I don't see why this is relevant to the P&T and yet not to the Bio, where it should belong.
      • Created a "Legacy" section and put this, along with the bit about Karath telling Malak about Nord's death, under that section.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
    • "When Bandon tracked down and confronted Revan after the former Sith Lord found the fourth of the five Star Maps, Bandon mentioned Nord to Revan, saying that while he might have been able to defeat Nord, Revan would be no match for the Shadow Hand." Same issue as above, though this has much less relevancy and needs to be checked and rewritten to match where it best fits.
    • I would definitely say that the last paragraph of the P&T warrants the need for an Equipment section, per the Layout Guide. Please take action as you see fit.
      • I was completely unaware that there was a "Equipment" section, don't see it that often. Added.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
    • "After Revan slew Nord, he had the opportunity to acquire the bounty hunter's datapad, armor, and blasters." Again, please clarify how and why this is relevant to the P&T.
    • Shouldn't the datapad be mentioned in the Bio?
      • No, I don't think so. It has no real relevance to the game other than it being some item Revan could have found.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
    • First of all, please check your tense in the Bts; scenarios should almost always be in present. Second, please clarify "because he was supposed to be too weak to defeat the bounty hunter at that time".
      • Please try it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
        • It still needs to be clarified why Revan is "supposed to be too weak." CC7567 (talk) 03:57, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
          • I just decided to remove it outright. Seemed speculative, anyway.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 20:02, November 30, 2009 (UTC)
    • I'd recommend that you try to watch your linking. The object of linking is not to link every single relevant word to a different article (i.e. [[Jedi/Legends|Jedi]] [[Jedi Knight/Legends|Knight]] turned [[Sith/Legends|Sith]] [[Sith Lord/Legends|Lord]]) but to link relevant articles without making it look unattractive. Please also watch your verb tense. CC7567 (talk)
      • Alright. Thank you very much for the review, CC.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, November 28, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Karath told Malak that while Nord had been hired for a hefty fee, Nord's services were worth the price." Hired for what? Is this ever clarified in the game? If this much is known, then the article needs to reflect this. CC7567 (talk) 03:57, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
  6. Fresh pasta in a pomodoro sauce, as ordered.
    • This statement is misleading (and a run-on): "During the final year of the Jedi Civil War, Nord was on the planet Taris in Kang's estate when Malak, who had betrayed Revan and usurped control of the Sith Empire, ordered the planet's destruction in an attempt to kill Jedi Knight Bastila Shan, who was also on the world."
      • First, Nord was on the planet but was caught in the quarantine. Double check the statements made, because this is alluded to.
      • Second, there is no mention here of what he was doing on Taris other than being in Kang's estate. When he is first seen, he isn't in Kang's estate. Rather, he is working the Lower City. This statement implies he was simply lounging around at Kang's place.
      • Third, I know some context on the Jedi Civil War is necessary, but this is too cumbersomely written for an introduction. It comes off as forced and it really breaks the flow. The run-on nature of it does not help.
        • Please try it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:16, December 9, 2009 (UTC)
          • I'm beginning to be jaded by the constant qualifiers of Malak overthrowing Revan. This is almost unnecessary. If the wording can be lessened even more, it would be better. Otherwise, it is not enough for me to hold the objection formally. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 03:55, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
      • Fourth, the mention of the bombardment should coincide with the mention of Shan, which it currently does, but in the rearranged and rewritten opening to this paragraph.
    • "When the Sith began to bombard Taris, Nord and Kang tried to kill Shan…" This reads awkwardly. It should be clarified that Nord and Kang were trying to escape and that they caught the team trying to steal the ship. In the firefight… (however you choose to continue).
    • "Nord eventually became a bounty hunter himself…" So, there is a gap in time between killing those who wanted him dead and becoming a bounty hunter?
    • "He often worked for Davik Kang…" What says this? This seems like an OR conclusion based upon the fact that he was doing some contracts on Taris at that time. Is there anything in the game that says Kang was Nord's most frequent employer?
    • "At some point during his lifetime, Nord was also hired by the Galactic Republic for operations in the Core." This is just dropped in. I highly recommend placing this after mentioning his career starting. Basically, almost anywhere before the Davik Kang / Taris stuff, not in the middle.
    • "While on Taris, Nord was often be found in the Hutt Zax's bounty office…" Again, what in the game dictates that he was most often present in the cantina? What states he spent the majority of his time there? This seems like OR.
      • Eh, Mission Vao tells Revan, "He hangs around Zax's bounty office, but I don't think he's looking for work there." Probably not enough to say he spent his free time there, so I just put this down. "While on Taris, Nord could occasionally be found…"--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:14, December 10, 2009 (UTC)
    • The first sentence of Jedi Civil War: the offset em dash clause should be made into its own separate sentence at the beginning of the paragraph if that much detail is going to be given about the war's unfolding. The offset clause is too long and it destroys the flow of the root thought. In reality, this entire paragraph seems overdone and almost irrelevant at its current length. I know other Inqs want context, but this is too much. There is not enough about Nord here to warrant this.
      • I think I've shortened it enough, for example, the context on how Shan reached Taris is not needed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:14, December 10, 2009 (UTC)
    • The offset em dash clause in the first sentence of the second paragraph of Jedi Civil War is also too cumbersome. If a predicating paragraph is going to remain, this information should be there. I don't care about Revan's history when trying to talk about how he ran into Nord twice. That should already be taken care of considering the lengths that have been gone to in order to qualify the war already.
    • In the same sentence, the double apostrophes are too awkward. Reword this, please.
    • In what way did Ordo work for Kang? Explain. Also, tie this in quicker. I admit that the perpetual who and whose clauses are feeling tiresome. Can this phrase even be reworded?
    • I will stop here for now. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 18:50, December 9, 2009 (UTC)
  7. LtNOWIS
    • It's unclear where the 5 sentences in the "Early life and bounty hunter" section are from. Can you add citations for those statements? -LtNOWIS 01:11, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
      • The first five? They come from the strategy guide, and the citation's already there.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:23, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
        • Ah, I see. -LtNOWIS 18:48, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
  8. Pasta, second serving
    • For reference, see above as there are objections outstanding.
    • "Nord survived the attack and was able to escape Taris before the Sith completely destroyed the surface of the planet." What says that he left Taris before the attack was completed?
      • Nothing, and nothing says that he left after, either. Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 18:17, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
    • "When Nord had sufficiently recovered…" What says this? I could not find this in the dialogue.
    • "Admiral Karath brought Nord in as an eyewitness…" Run-on. This could easily be three sentences.
    • "Karath told Malak that while Nord had been hired to capture Shan for a hefty fee, Nord's services were worth the price." This is awkward and out of place. Please fit this in to the flow of the conversation better.
    • "Before Nord left to locate Shan…" This sets up the bombshell statement to come as unimportant. Establish that Nord had more information rather than an "oh, by the way" statement.
    • Two things:
      • "Nord hired two Rodian and two Aqualish henchmen…" Umm, yeah. This sentence really a run-on. Three or more sentences should be made from this. Please also excise the unnecessary "context" that burdens this as well.
        • Please try it. I feel that some of the context needs to stay, if I removed all of it, a reader would think "OK, Revan's a Republic soldier in the previous section, and now he's a Jedi? How'd that happen?"--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 18:17, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
          • Multiple things:
            • Now the extra bounty hunters bit needs to be tied into something, but not too much of something.
            • Please excise the em dash clause from the second sentence. Give a very, very brief statement about Revan and his hunt for the Maps and Forge before saying he was located.
            • Make sure it is clear that Nord set an ambush while the team was inside the cave.
      • It is implied, as it stands now, that the henchmen were hired before going to Tatooine. There is nothing that establishes that, so it needs to be reworded.
    • "Nord confronted Revan after the Jedi found a second Rakatan Star Map, which was necessary to locate the Star Forge, in the cave of a krayt dragon, a creature native to Tatooine." Please reorder this sentence so fewer commas exist. This sentence is very messy.
    • No quote for the legacy section? Nothing from Malak or elsewhere?
      • No, not that I could find.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 18:17, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
        • What about something from his datapad or what Bandon or Malak said about Nord not being able to handle Revan?
    • More later. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 03:55, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
  9. Pasta… third course and antipasto
    • "Kang perished, and Nord tried to use a thermal detonator to kill everyone, including himself." What says that Nord wanted to kill himself? I can see him wanting to kill Revan and his group, but suicide? What says any of what is in this sentence after 'detonator'?
      • I don't think Nord necessarily was suicidal, but when he was defeated, he says "You may have me outnumbered and outgunned, but if I'm going down I'm taking all you with me! This thermal detonator will blow us all to bits!". This indicates he was at least willing to kill himself to ensure Revan's, Shan's, Ordo's, and Onasi's deaths.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:40, January 29, 2010 (UTC)
        • Well, then, it needs to be worded to communicate such. As it stands now, it sounds like he was going kamikaze. It needs to be reflected, especially in the P&T that he desired no one to best him and the lengths he would have gone through to make sure this did not happen.
    • "Many people dismissed Nord's story as a myth that was created to scare aspiring criminals." Please double check that this actually comes from the KotOR SG. The sentences around it came from the databank, so I changed the citation to the proper source. Seeing that, I am skeptical that this sentence is in the SG. Also, please confirm "many," as that seems like speculation.
      • Yes, that particular part does come from Nord's entry in the strategy guide. I think the "many" came from the databank, so I omitted it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:51, February 2, 2010 (UTC)
        • Does it give a qualifier for "people" in the text? Obviously, it was not "many," but is there another?
    • "Occasionally, people who disturbed Nord were not aware that the bounty hunter was giving them a chance to leave before he would attack." What says this? This seems like speculation.
    • "Even so, Nord would [!] not give them a second chance and killed those who bothered him without much effort." Same as prior. Also, watch how would is used, as it is rarely a pure past tense.
    • The bit about the datapad in the P&T needs to be distilled so that it is about his desire to claim a krayt dragon and not about the actual equipment. That belongs in the next section.
    • The last paragraph of P&T probably should be recast into a relationships section and slightly expanded as information exists without fluff or speculation. It should be highlighted as a professional relationships section more than personal, but any existing information about his parents would be relevant here as well.
      • I'm not so sure. There's nothing saying that he had any contact with Bandon, and there's little info on his other professional relationships. All we know is that Ordo and Nord did not like each other, Kang hired him occassionally, and that his parents sold him and he killed them when he turned 16.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:40, January 29, 2010 (UTC)
        • Fair enough, but the article contains more than merely that.
    • "Nord was a man of many possessions." Huh? What is this supposed to mean?
    • "In The Sith Lords, the sequel to Knights of the Old Republic, there was a suit of battle armor called "Verpine Zal Alloy Mesh". In-game, this armor appears similar to the armor that Revan could acquire from Nord after killing him." Umm— what states this? Are conclusions being drawn because the armor looks like the other when played or because of in-game mechanics (stats)? Or, is there actually something that says this?
      • Removed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:40, January 29, 2010 (UTC)
        • Okay, so it is removed. My question remains. Where did this come from? Was it speculation or was it found somewhere. If it is true, it makes an excellent point that should actually be in the equipment section.
          • I think this was speculation that I did not catch until I deleted it, so.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 05:00, February 9, 2010 (UTC)
    • The second paragraph of the Bts needs to have parallel order within it. If the order introduced is Tatooine, Kashyyyk, Manaan, and then Korriban, the extrapolations need to be in that order as well.
    • The last paragraph of the Bts should talk about the player, not Revan. Please recast this.
      • Taken care of.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:40, January 29, 2010 (UTC)
        • Now the wording is awkward. Please reduce the number of "the player" noun phrases as it is written very poorly right now. There is no reason why "the player" should appear in every sentence, let alone more than once in a sentence. Be creative with the wording, please.
    • Well, okay. More later. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 04:20, January 29, 2010 (UTC)
  10. Pasta, leftovers
    • Four objections outstanding above. I'm adding more here because I want these to get done at the same time.
    • "After Nord ordered a custom suit…" The suit needs to be talked about in some measure of detail before it is presented so passively.
    • Both instances of the term "shadow hand" need to be cited to the CG as they are never mentioned or even alluded to in the game.
    • What in the game actually states that he understood Huttese?
      • Nothing, I guess, Didn't the Rodians on Taris speak Huttese? I'm not sure, but I guess this is speculation. Removed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 04:35, February 9, 2010 (UTC)
    • "In 3,957 BBY, Darth Malak…" This does not come from the databank, and while I do not have the CSWE directly in front of me, I am most certain this date does not appear in there, either. There are real sources to apply here.
    • — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 20:03, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  11. Pasta… fifth round… this time, the whole way through… again…
    • "When contracted, Kang hired Nord to kill and bring back the heads of rancors so that the crime lord could mount the heads in his trophy room." Does the datapad actually say that Nord killed these things for Kang?
      • Yes it does, if you want to take a look at it yourself, the dialogue is present in the datapad's article.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • "One year later, Malak conquered Taris and ordered his fleet to blockade the planet so that the Sith forces could search for the Jedi Knight Bastila Shan." The capturing of Taris and the rescuing of Bastila Shan are two separate events. This sentence paints them as one continuous cycle. What needs to be especially clarified is when the quarantining took place verses when Shan became trapped on the planet. Please reword this accordingly.
      • Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:01, February 20, 2010 (UTC)
        • They are not in the right order, and it reads confusingly. Taris was captured before the Endar Spire was attacked.
          • Are you sure? I seem to remember Taris being captured after Shan landed on the planet. Anyway, it's in the right order.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:54, February 28, 2010 (UTC)
            • Yes, because the capture, quarantine, and bombardment are three separate events.
    • "After Revan located and rescued Shan…" This paragraph needs to be recast to focus on Nord, not Revan. Crop or distill whatever is unnecessary in the process, but do not add fluff that is speculative.
    • "Nord revealed his intent to kill the group to Kang, stating that he had looked forward to doing so for a long time. Kang told the bounty hunter to hurry, saying that if they did not escape, the Sith's lasers would be their demise." This comes off as a spoiled child asking for something at the mall, and the parent obliging. Did Nord have to dispatch with the group? Did Kang oblige just because? Please reconstruct this so that the timeline comes off as more proper.
      • Reworded, I think. In-game, after Kang told Revan that they weren't going to take the ship, Nord stated he'd kill them, and looked forward to doing it. Kang then told them to make it quick cause of the Sith lasers.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:01, February 20, 2010 (UTC)
        • This change was excellent, Kasra.
    • "Karath informed Malak that Nord agreed to capture Shan and assured the emperor that the bounty hunter's services were worth the demanded price." It should be presented that Nord accepted to get Shan and then offer the confirmation by Karath. As it stands now, the timeline is disjunctive.
    • "Nord gave Revan credit for having evaded him thus far but stated that no one could ultimately escape him. When Revan asked Nord if they could work out a deal instead of fighting, Nord refused and attacked." I thought this trend of conversation was optional and not even for light-sided path. Please confirm that these things have to be said.
      • Yes it is optional. The dialogue options don't influence Revan's standing with either side of the Force. But I thought Wookieepedia also assumed the least aggressive dialogue options. As I told NaruHina above, the other options are these: "You traveled a long way just to die, Calo!" and, "You think I got lucky last time? Okay, let's do it again!".--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
        • I would rather no assumption of game mechanics like this be included. I've cut what was irrelevant.
          • Is there anything more you want me to do for this objection?--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:54, February 28, 2010 (UTC)
            • No. I wanted you to notice my comment.
    • "Shortly after Nord's death, Admiral Karath informed Darth Malak of Nord's failure. Malak told Karath that the penalty for failure was death, but that the failure belonged to Nord, not Karath himself." This is cited as having come from the CG and not the game. (Yes, I know this could qualify as {{sofixit}}, but careful interpolation of citation should be honored when addressing objections.)
      • Don't know how this happened. Fixed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • "…needing someone with more superior training and skill with the Force." What explicitly says this?
      • Nothing. Since you added this, I didn't think it worth removing. But now that you say something about it, it's removed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
        • Ah, I remember what I was getting at. My apologies. That said, doesn't the conversation with Malak make some mention that someone with Force ability would be the only one to take them down? I could be wrong, so could you double check?
    • "He spoke and comprehended Basic, the Republic trade language." This is a relic from before. What states he spoke Basic? Now, if this is conjecture based upon logical-connectivity, which is permitted in WP:ATT, then fine. But, this needs to be clarified, and expressed clearer if that is the claim.
      • I guess you could call it conjecture, but I sourced it to the campaign guide, since it explicitly states that he spoke Basic.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • "People dismissed Nord's story as a myth that was created to scare aspiring criminals." I've labored over this, but I really am not fond of the sentence starting with "people," especially given the context and the inter-species nature implied. I know it is more aesthetic than anything else, but please tweak the wording of this.
      • Well, what else could I say? Isn't the word "people" a word tha applies to all species, or is is a strictly a human-targeted word? I don't think I can say "galactic denizens" or "civilians", or even "citizens".--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • "The bounty hunter always found his prey, and he showed them no mercy, ignoring pleas and bribes." What in the game actually says this? Is this being implied because of how he treats the Rodian in Lower City or the pests in the cantina?
      • I remember sourcing this to the databank earlier, don't know how it ended up with a game source. Fixed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
        • Okay, except it is not in the Databank. Maybe the CG or SG?
          • I distinctly remember reading this somewhere that was an official source. Anyway, I can't find it now, so I removed it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:54, February 28, 2010 (UTC)
    • The second paragraph of the P&T is incredibly disjunctive and does not flow well together. Please restructure it so that it operates as one or two well-refined paragraphs.
      • I think it's fixed. Could you try it?--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • "Nord disliked the Mandalorian Canderous Ordo, who was also an employee of Davik Kang, and periodically taunted him." Where is this outright stated or is this implied by the taunting? If their relationship is that poor, what is said?
      • This is implied by the taunting. I had added the details of the conversation to the biography earlier, but an Inq told me to remove it, and I did.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
        • Something that is implied is not necessarily fact. I think this should be removed from here and from the relationships section. In the relationships section, however, his interaction of taunting should be listed.
          • This is only in the relationships section, and I removed it. Added the fact that he taunted Ordo.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:54, February 28, 2010 (UTC)
    • "Calo Nord used two Mandalorian heavy blasters as his primary weapons…" Is this listed solely because it is the item picked up off of Nord when defeated on Tatooine or is there something that states this?
      • The campaign guide states he used two blasters, and of course, as you said, the items are picked up from his corpse. I guess I should have added the CG source to the game source, but at the time, I didn;t think I need to, since everything else was sourced to the CG.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 19:09, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
    • Are all the compliments to Nord during each of the ambushes actually listed in the SG? In other words, does the SG actually state that Nord appears with Wookiees loyal to Chuundar? I thought this information came from the game. Also, to highlight what was objected to earlier: I mistakenly struck the objection that they were not in corresponding order. The sentence about using the submersible should be mentioned with Manaan, not after Korriban. Please fix this.
      • Admittedly, it had been a while since I'd looked in the SG, and I thought I read that this was in there, which is why I had originally sourced it as such. But it's not, my mistake. It's fixed now.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:03, February 20, 2010 (UTC)
  12. *I have been giving some serious thought to this, and I will say that there does need to be a relationships section. One paragraph is fine, summarizing his connections due to funding, his hatred of Ordo, his abandonment and how it provoked his demeanor and future, etc. This type of information should still be expressed here. Use the last paragraph of the P&T as the starting-point for this.

Comments

  • This is not a formal objection because I don't really believe in image objections except in the most extreme circumstances, but do you think it could use more screenshots from KOTOR? Actual live-action shots from the game feel underrepresented somehow. -- Darth Culator (Talk) 18:29, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
  • You make a good point, but seeing as I don't know how to upload images from the game, I'm kinda in a bind. Maybe one of the other users could help? Plus, the live-action pics would have to not include Revan.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:13, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Full credit goes to Nayayen for uploading this image for the article.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:16, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
  • OK, in lieu of this, full credit goes to Nayayen for this image.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:34, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Hey, Naru, I'm waiting for the results of this before I do more worl with the nom. I'll get the objections taken care of as soon as I can, though.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:05, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Alright. Good luck with it. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 03:18, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
  • I found this link on Nord's talk page. It states that this dude named Max Raphael voiced Nord. I was wondering if it's legit.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:27, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
    • I did some digging around and the only vague source is from IMDB saying that Max Raphael did "Additional voices". He is the narrator for the History channel's "Modern Marvels" and they certainly sound the same but I can't find anything saying explicitly that he did voice Nord. Apparently he is actually known as Lloyd Sherr, but that yields nothing more. NayayenOld Republic military symboltalk 21:40, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
      • Oh, well. Thanks, Nayayen.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:20, September 12, 2009 (UTC)
  • Nayayen gets credit for this image. Thanks, man.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 00:49, October 25, 2009 (UTC)
  • This article is Part 3 of "Project: Bad Guys of KotOR".--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:24, December 1, 2009 (UTC)
  • Just for the record, JJM has mentioned including Nord in the comics in his KotOR countdown. Nayayen—TALK 16:40, February 14, 2010 (UTC)
    • It's on there, thanks for the notice.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 23:54, February 28, 2010 (UTC)

Motion to strike objections from NaruHina (Inquisitorius vote only)

  1. Inqvote Naru's already given his support to the article, and he's unavailable to strike that last objection of his (which has been addressed) on his own.—Tommy9281 Dark side Master SWGTCG (No truth in me) 14:25, November 11, 2009 (UTC)
  2. Inqvote Cavalier OneFarStar(Squadron channel) 14:35, November 11, 2009 (UTC)
  3. Inqvote CC7567 (talk) 18:50, November 11, 2009 (UTC)
  4. Inqvote Someone should really inform me when these types of votes go up. Toprawa and Ralltiir 02:15, November 23, 2009 (UTC)
  5. Inqvote -- Darth Culator (Talk) 19:40, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

Approved as a Featured article by Inquisitorius 00:17, March 1, 2010 (UTC)