Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Bail Antilles/Legends

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The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was successful. Please do not modify it.

Bail Antilles

  • Nominated by: LelalMekha (talk) 15:00, December 31, 2012 (UTC)
  • Nomination comments: It certainly isn't ready, but I had to nominate it before the end of the Barn-burner. Be as harsh as needed.

(3 Inqs/4 Users/7 Total)

Support

  1. Great work. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 02:32, January 15, 2013 (UTC)
  2. Inqvote Sir Cavalier of OneFarStar(Squadron channel) 12:56, March 7, 2013 (UTC)
  3. Inqvote Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 16:16, April 3, 2013 (UTC)
  4. Ayrehead02 (talk) 13:48, April 6, 2013 (UTC)
  5. zzzZZZzzzzz... Oh... Nice article on a dull guy. ;) ~SavageBOB sig 15:03, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
  6. Finally got to reviewing the article. Good job. Hanzo Hasashi (talk) 17:14, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
  7. Inqvote CC7567 (talk) 19:09, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

Object

CC-8
  • In the intro when you say he was a senator you need to say the Senate was part of the Republic. Same goes for the bio.
    • Done. --LelalMekha (talk) 23:45, January 2, 2013 (UTC)
      • Forgot to check this myself earlier, but the Republic still needs to be linked in the intro
  • Say that the Nebula Front was a group, I read this thinking it was an area or something
  • Should there be an article on the assasination attempt on Valorum?
    • I'm not sure actually. I think we should hear the opinion of others on that matter before creating it. --LelalMekha (talk) 23:45, January 2, 2013 (UTC)
      • Well since it does have an impact on him, as in he was injured, I think it should have an article.
        • Then I'll make sure and create one tonight. --LelalMekha (talk) 11:57, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
          • In fact, an article already existed. It's now linked. --LelalMekha (talk) 02:05, January 15, 2013 (UTC)
  • I'll do the rest of this later. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 23:18, January 2, 2013 (UTC)
  • The rest: In the Invasion of Naboo section "lackey" seems like a bit of a slack word to use in the article, which might just be me my perception but I thought I'd bring it up.
    • Changed. Instead of "lackeys," the text now reads "Federation allies." --LelalMekha (talk) 11:57, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
  • In that paragraph you should proabably put Valorum's name somewhere rather than referring to him as other things
    • Added one mention of his name. See if it suffices. --LelalMekha (talk) 11:57, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
  • Also, Antilles' fierce corruption fighting had gained him a reputation of an overzealous reformer, which rendered him undesirable to the many greedy delegates I think this sentence shouldn't start off with also, just doesn't read right to me.
    • Well, it may stem from my not being a native speaker of English. The text now reads "besides." Is that all right? --LelalMekha (talk) 11:57, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
      • I was more thinking that the sentence shouldn't start with a word like also or besides, it makes it sound like it's just been attached as another quick thing. I'd word it as Antilles fierce corruption fighting had also gained him... or something like that. Sorry for not being too clear earlier. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 22:29, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
  • I saw a Legacy section in this article before it was nominated, I was just wondering why it was removed, and it's still worth mentioning anyway that someone was named after him. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 04:25, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
    • Well, that's the point: we cannot be sure those two people were named after him. It has never been stated anywhere. Additionnally, "Antilles" seems to be a very common name among Humans—see Jon Antilles's BTS—and the first name "Bail" was shared by at least two Alderaanian males of the same generation. This is why I removed the legaçy section, because we just cannot tell whether those two other Bail Antilles were named after him or if it's just a coincidence. --LelalMekha (talk) 11:57, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
Jangeth
  • Before I continue, could you source the final link in the succession box? JangFett (Talk) 17:28, February 1, 2013 (UTC)
Cav
  • Antilles suggested instead that the Trade Federation simply avoid the dangerous areas; it was not to the liking of representatives of the planets there. The second half here, after the ";" - where is "there"? Where the representatives are gathered, or the planets in the regions affected?
    • I expanded on that part in order to make things clearer. Just check it and tell me if it's clear enough. --LelalMekha (talk) 22:19, March 4, 2013 (UTC)
  • Antilles, along with Ryyder, still attempted to meet privately with the Chancellor before that moment. - the wording here suggest that Antilles and Ryyder tried to meet with the Chancellor before this attempt. Is that the case?
    • Actually, I reworded that sentence and moved it to the next paragraph. Works better in this fashion. --LelalMekha (talk) 22:19, March 4, 2013 (UTC)
  • as his second mandate drew to a close - "second mandate?" Do you mean second term of office by this?
    • Yes, but I just changed the wording to "second term of office," as you suggested. --LelalMekha (talk) 22:19, March 4, 2013 (UTC)
  • Antilles gave paid little attention to the Outer Rim Territories—or so it was said. - by whom? - Sir Cavalier of OneFarStar(Squadron channel) 21:36, March 4, 2013 (UTC)
Attack of the Clone
  • A couple prelims before I start. First, please make sure that the article thoroughly follows WP:DASH. In particular, I'm seeing several places that should be using the en dash, e.g. "Post–22 BBY," "pre–31 BBY," etc. (Fact File pages also need the en dash, e.g. "1–4" instead of "1-4.")
    • I just checked throughout the text and fixed a few such mistakes, but I'll have to read it once again later to be sure—it's four o'clock here, and my brain is a fair bit slower than it should be. --LelalMekha (talk) 03:21, March 10, 2013 (UTC)
      • I hope it is now correct and ready for your review. --LelalMekha (talk) 17:49, March 12, 2013 (UTC)
  • Per the Layout Guide, the "See also" section is reserved for articles not already linked in the article, which doesn't look to be the case. CC7567 (talk) 17:13, March 8, 2013 (UTC)
    • Nixed that thing. Must be a remnant from before I started working on the article. --LelalMekha (talk) 03:21, March 10, 2013 (UTC)
  • In ref note 2, could you provide a little more explanation? Even though the clone trooper appearance is mentioned, it doesn't seem immediately clear that it's the reason for the post–22 BBY dating. That needs to be explicitly stated or at least clarified a little more directly.
    • I tried to clarify the matter. See if that helps. --LelalMekha (talk) 01:04, March 25, 2013 (UTC)
  • Please take note of the proper capitalization of position titles such as senator. The only time "Senator" should be capitalized is when it's referring to an individual holding the title, not when it refers to the title/position itself. This needs to be checked and corrected throughout the article.
    • Checked and corrected. Unless I'm mistaken, it should be correct this time. There is, however, one case I wasn't sure how to handle: "the Twi'lek senator Orn Free Taa of Ryloth." I guess both "senator" and "Senator" would be acceptable here. --LelalMekha (talk) 01:04, March 25, 2013 (UTC)
      • A few of them were fine as they were, so I've adjusted them; please take note of them. CC7567 (talk) 14:41, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
  • "the taxation of trade routes" in the intro: anything that can be linked here, namely this law/Senate decree?
    • Please check this; I'm not seeing a change. CC7567 (talk) 14:41, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
      • Well, I never claimed there was a change either, since I did not answer that particular objection. ;) Actually, I'm still trying to figure out whether there's anything to link. --LelalMekha (talk) 15:37, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
        • I believe Senate Resolution BR-0371 is what you're looking for, though please check to make sure. CC7567 (talk) 15:48, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
          • Thanks, that seems to be right. Linked both in the intro and in the body. --LelalMekha (talk) 00:19, March 30, 2013 (UTC)
  • "and Palpatine received the anointing of the Senate": the election needs to be linked somewhere in here.
  • I made the mistake of starting to review just as the current Inqmoot is starting, so I will return soon. CC7567 (talk) 23:49, March 16, 2013 (UTC)
    • Do take your time. ;) --LelalMekha (talk) 01:04, March 25, 2013 (UTC)
  • One more before I look at the article body: it's not necessary to keep referring to him as "Prince Antilles" and "Bail Antilles" throughout the article, unless that's necessary to distinguish him from other people with the name Antilles (which doesn't seem to be the case for the most part). Seeing as he's the subject of the article, it should only be necessary to refer to him by the full "Bail Antilles"/"Prince Antilles" once or twice—at most—near the beginning of the article body. Currently I'm seeing a bit too many usages of "Bail Antilles"/"Prince Antilles"/"Prince Bail Antilles," so please try to cut down on some. CC7567 (talk) 14:41, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
  • Also, please make sure to format ref notes in numerical order, ex. [12][11] in the succession box and not [11][12]. CC7567 (talk) 14:43, March 29, 2013 (UTC)
Cadeth
  • "occupied a highly prestigious function" - I'm not sure function is the correct word here. Maybe position?
    • Since I'm no native speaker of English, I'll trust your judgement. --LelalMekha (talk) 19:04, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • "and the conservative Rim faction, opposed to Valorum's measures and using Senator Ainlee Teem of Malastare as their spokesbeing." Any way you can get rid of the present tense "using"?
    • See if that sounds better. --LelalMekha (talk) 19:04, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • Article for the false consortium, maybe?
    • In fact, there is no false consortium. It seems I did not express myself well, but it has been corrected. --LelalMekha (talk) 19:04, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • "He notably assisted to a representation of..." I think there's an extra word here.
    • Changed to "notably attended a representation of" --LelalMekha (talk) 19:04, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • "got his lines off in his best impersonation" - any way you could clean up the language here? It's rather... casual, and a little unwieldy in my opinion.
    • Please tell me if the new wording is more proper. --LelalMekha (talk) 19:04, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • Good work. Cade GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit Calrayn 18:34, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
Ayrehead
  • Impressive work but just as few things I noticed reading through. Firstly can we have a little context on the Perlemian Orbital Facility pretty much just the fact it orbit Coruscant.
    • Thank you. Context has just been added. --LelalMekha (talk) 10:15, April 6, 2013 (UTC)
  • In the Bts section could you mention which sources the other two Bail Antilles appear in the text instead of just references? Ayrehead02 (talk) 13:36, April 5, 2013 (UTC)
Attack II
  • Why exactly is the "Post–22 BBY" date being used in the infobox's "death" field? Although we do assume that all characters eventually die, the infobox field should only be used to detail directly stated information from a source/appearance that the character died at a specific point (or range) in time. I don't believe it's necessary in this case, particularly when the article doesn't mention anywhere that he eventually died—nor should it, seeing as a source hasn't stated he did.
    • I must confess that I'm always tempted to give indications even when the date of death is not known for certain. Anyway, I just removed that bit. --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
  • "along with other aides, Ryyder and Palpatine": can this be reworded/reordered slightly? Even though the intended meaning is "aides," "Ryyder," and "Palpatine," the way that it's currently worded sounds as though "aides" is context for Ryyder and Palpatine.
    • The order is now changed. --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
  • "about a hostage situation": if Valorum mentioned this to Antilles, it should be specified what kind of situation this is. An event should also ideally be linked.
    • I just adressed the matter, but still avoided giving too much information (the story arc of the Prominence has little to do with Antilles himself). --LelalMekha (talk) 19:00, April 9, 2013 (UTC)
      • Is there an article for this event? It sounds like one should be created if it doesn't yet exist. CC7567 (talk) 17:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
  • "Taa had discovered that a shipping corporation": I'm assuming this is Valorum Shipping and Transport, but if so, that needs to be directly mentioned by name or at least linked here.
  • "represented the prosecution in the subsequent Supreme Court inquiry": would an article for this inquiry/trial be warranted?
  • Is there any chance that you could expand the final paragraph of "The taxation debates"? If I remember correctly, the novel depicted at least a portion of the trial, and something to do with Valorum's attorney/lawyer in his response to Antilles' charges. Any more details regarding the trial—and Antilles' involvement in it—would be helpful.
    • Does that look better now? --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
      • Yeah, a lot better. Just one more thing: how did Valorum respond to Antilles' "note" about the correlation between the disappeared aurodium and the transfer to Valorum Shipping? And also, was there a resolution to the inquiry? Was Valorum found guilty? That will tie into the fact that his reputation was sullied following the inquiry. CC7567 (talk) 17:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
        • From what I gather, the inquiry never really went any further, because the events of the Naboo Crisis began immediately afterwards. In TPM, Palpatine mentions that Valorum is "mired down by baseless accusations of corruption." --LelalMekha (talk) 19:00, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
  • "During the campaign, Antilles organized a political meeting aboard the Perlemian Orbital Facility, a space station orbiting around Coruscant. The prince had obtained the support of several senators and businessbeings, as well as that of Jedi Master Jorus C'baoth, who had been tasked with settling a dispute among some of Alderaan's noble houses. Since Antilles had gained popularity following the taxation debates, he was considered the top candidate for the chancellorship by both the holomedia and his fellow senators." I think this section can be tweaked in terms of order to flow a little better. It sounds like it might work better if the third sentence came first, then the second sentence, and then what is currently the first sentence, to help with chronology. Also, who was invited to his "political meeting"? His allies?
    • Followed your suggestion. It does make it clearer, I've got to admit it. --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
      • Just looking for a bit to satisfy the last part of the objection—were there any specific individuals invited to the meeting? It sounds like they should be named if known. CC7567 (talk) 17:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
        • Once again, the wording wasn't as clear as it should have been. Now it should be good. --LelalMekha (talk) 19:00, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
  • I think it can be made clear somewhere in the body (either early on when Alderaan is first mentioned in the Bio, or later on when the Core Worlds are mentioned in the P&T) that Alderaan specifically was a Core World, just to make sure it's clear to the reader.
    • Indeed. --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
      • As a general note, please make sure to double-check and readjust linking after adding to or changing parts of the article. In this case, galaxy had to be re-linked here instead of later in the article, and there were also some others that I fixed due to other addressed objections. CC7567 (talk) 17:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
  • "When Antilles was led to represent": this bit is slightly awkwardly worded. Do you mean "obligated" to represent the prosecution, on account of his position on the Internal Activities Committee?
    • It now reads "When his position on the Internal Activities Committee obligated him to represent the prosecution on Chancellor's Valorum trial (...)" --LelalMekha (talk) 13:52, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
  • "During his time on Coruscant, Antilles visited the Coruscant Opera House, like many other politicians of the time. He notably attended a representation of The Brief Reign of Future Wraiths, a Corellian opera performed by a touring Bith company." This sounds like it would be a bit more relevant to be mentioned in the Biography than in the P&T, since—unlike the part about his penchant for Gizer ale and his favorite restaurant—it doesn't provide any specific habits.
  • Please use {{WebCite}} for the TFN citation note. CC7567 (talk) 19:19, April 6, 2013 (UTC)
  • Since "Character origins" has been moved to the beginning of the Bts, a small transition is needed from that section to "Portrayal," when you talk about this specific character, the one who is now Bail Antilles. Either at the end of "Character origins" or around the beginning of "Portrayal," I would suggest saying something like, "Bail Antilles was eventually established as a separate character from Organa." That would be necessary because otherwise, "Portrayal" immediately assumes that the reader already knows he's a separate character, which hasn't been properly established; the "Character origins" section only leaves the reader with the impression that Bail Antilles was an unused name.
  • Would it be relevant to mention by name (and link) the incident at Dorvalla and Revenue anywhere in the article, in relation to the aurodium ingots? The latter might not be necessary, but if possible I'd like to see the former article at least linked somewhere, since it ties into the specific "cache of ingots reported missing a few months earlier by the Trade Federation." CC7567 (talk) 17:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
    • I tried to include the incident at Dorvalla under "an attack." --LelalMekha (talk) 19:00, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
Savaged…
  • Can we get an article on the Bith company?
  • It seems logical that the "Character origins" should come first in BTS, non? ~SavageBOB sig 11:51, April 8, 2013 (UTC)
    • Well, yes, absolutely. Changed now, as you've already seen it. --LelalMekha (talk) 13:55, April 8, 2013 (UTC)

Comments

Approved as a Featured article by Inquisitorius 19:09, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

  • A round of applauses for Lelal! Good work getting it in on time. 501st dogma(talk) 23:42, December 31, 2012 (UTC)
    • Umm... is this a support or actually a comment. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 00:02, January 1, 2013 (UTC)
      • Its a comment. Its under "Comments"..... 501st dogma(talk) 00:39, January 1, 2013 (UTC)
        • Oh, it just sound like a support and had a number at the start, so I thought it could've been the wrong section. Never mind. Commander Code-8 To say hi, press 42 06:47, January 1, 2013 (UTC)
          • My bad about the number. 501st dogma(talk) 13:15, January 1, 2013 (UTC)
  • What about it do you think isn't ready? Any sources you need checked? Let us know when you think it's ready. Menkooroo (talk) 13:16, January 6, 2013 (UTC)
  • I have an issue about photos from that deleted scene being used in-universe. considering that the deleted scene showed Adrian Dunbar as "Bail Organa," I don't think that scene is canon, and I don't think photos from that deleted scene should be included in any in-universe parts of the article. Hanzo Hasashi (talk) 16:50, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
    • Well, I originally discussed that issue with SavageBob, and he answered to me: "If Dunbar has been retconned as Antilles, then I'd say it's a duck test to say that any images of him are images of Bail Antilles, not of "Adrian Dunbar as possibly Bail Organa."" In fact, his character was changed to Antilles even during production, and the name Organa is never prononced during that scene. If you can't get over that issue, I will have to take those picture off, but I really think they are useful. --LelalMekha (talk) 16:56, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
      • Not familiar with the deleted scene, but were the events of that mentioned in other canon? Hanzo Hasashi (talk) 17:10, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
        • It hasn't. But technically, it is not so much about using the scene itself as about using Dunbar's likeness, which was confirmed to be that of Antilles. Since Antilles was indeed confirmed to be the Senator of Alderaan at the time, and since Merian and Aldrete did appear as his aides in Star Wars: Episode I The Visual Dictionary, it's seems like fair game. --LelalMekha (talk) 17:21, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
          • Hmmm maybe you should ask other users about that then, I don't know what to make of that. Hanzo Hasashi (talk) 17:26, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
  • Not strictly an objection, but as Tope has recently objected to Kasra's noms about mentioning species and gender again in the personality and traits, perhaps consider removing it too? I personally never saw it as necessary, though never held them as valid objections. Hanzo Hasashi (talk) 18:43, February 24, 2013 (UTC)
    • While I do have a preference for mentioning both species and gender in the P&T, I agree to remove it in case someone makes an objection of it. --LelalMekha (talk) 18:56, February 24, 2013 (UTC)