Forum:SH:OOU Media Index pages

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Forums > Senate Hall archive > SH:OOU Media Index pages

Hello, after off and on discussion in the Discord around how to document certain parts of video games both to preserve them and to ease future editing I am put forwarding an addition to the Index page layout guide to include out of universe media.

The following would be added to the Index Page section in the Wookieepedia:Layout Guide page:

Out of Universe Index pages

Example: (User:ThePedantry/OutlawsIndex) Out of universe index pages are an optional subpage that can be created in the Index namespace as Index:PAGENAME for any piece of media's article. These index pages can consist of two main sections: Media Index and Media Databank; Both detailed below.

Media Index

A single alphabetical list of in universe subjects that appear or are mentioned in the media. Each entry will list a subject followed by an mdash; then provide information to aid a reader in locating the subject within the media. These are particularly useful for large media such as video games.

Alphabetical sorting

Media Databank

Media databank is an optional section on a media's index page that includes photos and screenshots of parts of that media. These take the form of tables which include but not limited to the screenshot, the name, and a transcription of any lore included in the screenshot. These are useful for documenting limited time events, information that may not remain available after the lifetime of a game or difficult to find information. Important: the media databank is not meant to include whole copies of a piece of media such as player handbooks.

Examples from different media types

  • Audiobooks — images packaging with publication or other credit information.
  • Board games and card games — sections of rule books with relevant lore.
  • Books — images of publication or other credit information.
  • Comics — images of publication or other credit information.
  • Film — screenshots of Aurebesh and other written languages shown within the media.
  • Toys — images of packaging with relavent publishing information.
  • Video Games — cosmetics, codex, collectibles, events, items and quests info

More details

I am looking for more feedback on this before putting it up for a full CT. The Current example link (User:ThePedantry/OutlawsIndex) is one that I have worked on for Star Wars Outlaws and Bonzane10 has been working on a simlar thing for Star Wars Hunters (Wookieepedia:Star Wars: Hunters screenshots. Some things I am particularly wondering about:

  1. Should media index and databank be separate pages?
  2. is Media databank an okay name?
  3. Should the index page specify appearance, mention, indirect mention?
    • If so should it be specified overall or on each occurance (Page number, Chapter, Timestamp, Quest, Databank)?
  4. Formatting related to video game

— ThePedantry (talk) 22:13, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

  • Seems like a worthy pursuit, and I wouldn't be opposed to it, so long of course this work under the same principles than IU index pages. I must also raise one question: do we want to do this kind of pages for works that already features an internal index, by copying it? I'm not familiar with this kind of thing, but aren't there software that could convert the text content of an image into pure text? I can easily think of case where people could be interested in that when they research a topic, wonder if it's in a book and want an index to check relevant content. Could even be of interest if you already own the book... having a large library, I know how bothersome it can be check book after book for mention in indexes... especially when you must be careful because of worn (my sweet SWTOR Encyclopedia...). NanoLuukeCloning Facility 08:10, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
    • If I understand correctly what you're saying, the process of converting images to text is called OCR, and AFAIK it's still not 100% reliable unfortunately. Imperators II(Talk) 14:30, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
    • Yeah I think media with internal indexes like reference books are included in this, and it even fixes it a head start. I will agree with Imperators II, that OCR and AFAIK it is not 100% reliable so I wouldn't want to use it for any kind of automated process. That said I could see it being useful if an editor wants to use it to get a first pass version. But the editor would be responsible for verifying the contents and correcting mistakes. - ThePedantry (talk) 19:25, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
  • Also since this is a specific OOU topic, it should be considered under the LG/OOU, not the general LG. And the namespace cannot simply be Index alone, because a media can, at the same time, be the subject of a regular index (where does this media is mentioned) and features, as you suggest, it's own index. Maybe a subpage? Index:xxxxx/Media? Though, I trust more knowledgeable editors to provides a good technical solution to this potential issue ^^. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 08:31, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
    • My understanding is that there isn't any regular index for the media itself so that current pages would still be available. - ThePedantry (talk) 19:25, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
      • But there should and will be, so that not something to dismiss outright. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 20:05, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
        • I think this what the oou media index page would be. I could be misunderstanding what you're saying so as an example this would be [Index:Star Wars Outlaws]. Our current index policy is only for in universe subjects. ThePedantry (talk) 06:53, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
          • Absolutely not: SH and CT discussions never mentioned a specificity to IU; the policy is hosted on the general LG, not the IU LG; the policy itself doesn't make such a distinction: "An index page is an optional subpage that can be created in the Index namespace as Index:PAGENAME for any mainspace article"; there are already a couple OOU indexes: Index:Untitled Star Wars Resistance episode (Ax Tagrin), Index:Encyclopedia (StarWars.com), Index:Project Ragtag and Index:Star Wars Resistance. NanoLuukeCloning Facility 07:47, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
  • As to question 3: imo, if we're making a voluntary subpage for scrupulously documenting every featuring of a given subject in a work, then yes, it should be geared toward listing any and all applicable Appearances/Sources templates (like 1stm and so on) for each of the instances where the subject is featured. Imperators II(Talk) 14:30, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
    • I guess an example will help, for Bram in Star Wars Outlaws it would be something like the following where each sections specify if it is a mention only, or pictured only or if not then it is an appearance. Shano, Bran — Game Map (Cantonica), Expert Abilities, Main quests (Beginnings, Outlaws (flashback), Underworld (mo), The Heist), ISB Reports (Bram Shano), Items (Ironweave (mo)), Character Databank (Key Vess (mo)), Location Databank (The Broken Hoof (mo)) - ThePedantry (talk) 19:25, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
      • Yeah, the full deal. Maximize potential usefulness to the readers and editors. Imperators II(Talk) 19:32, 3 February 2025 (UTC)
        • Does the format in that example seem good to communicate that? ThePedantry (talk) 06:52, 4 February 2025 (UTC)
          • Perhaps formatting it as bullet points would make it more readable? Imperators II(Talk) 21:00, 5 February 2025 (UTC)
            • Yeah, I made an example of it on User:ThePedantry/OutlawsIndex#S for Bram and I agree I think it's more readable for subjects with multiple entries. It will mean the index will be longer. - ThePedantry (talk) 22:24, 6 February 2025 (UTC)
  • I more or less agree. This is an endeavor Wook should've done a long time ago imo, especially for games that relied on the internet like Uprising. For the first point, I personally think both could be put under a single index page. Second point, don't think we need to include the "media" bit into the title. "Index:[insert media name]" should do fine, I feel like. For the third point, I assume it works similarly to how index page is right now on IU articles? Bonzane10 Bonzane10-Sig 04:59, 7 February 2025 (UTC)
  • For the last point about VG formatting, I think a mixture of lists (similar to current index) and tables would serve us well. If we are to document the appearances of every subjects and other notable objects, the index page will be bloated to oblivion, especially comparing it to how much stuff listed there are in the Appearance section of the relevant media, so the general ones as a list would somewhat eliminate that I suppose. Tables can be implemented for quests, databank entries, and other more specified info drop. Bonzane10 Bonzane10-Sig 05:05, 7 February 2025 (UTC)