Forum:CT:Utilizing Atlas grid coordinates

Forums > Consensus track archive > CT:Utilizing Atlas grid coordinates

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The result of the debate was Adopt addendum to Layout Guide. Toprawa and Ralltiir (talk) 11:19, February 23, 2013 (UTC)

At the Mofference last November, the topic of whether grid coordinates from The Essential Atlas and the ongoing Star Wars: The Essential Atlas Online Companion should be treated as in-universe or out-of-universe information was discussed. The community decision was to send a query to the writers, Jason Fry and Daniel Wallace, to see how the coordinate system was intended for use. Refer to Forum:SH:Sending official question to Daniel Wallace/Jason Fry for their replies.

In short (paraphrasing from Fry's and Wallace's answers), the grid coordinates were intended to help us, the out-of-universe readers, navigate the extensive Atlas maps. Both Fry and Wallace admit that the coordinates could potentially function as in-universe material as well, since nothing outright denies it, but both state that the coordinates were not intended to be in-universe. For that reason, it looks as though we should respect their intentions and treat the grid coordinates as out-of-universe, meaning that they can be noted in infoboxes (namely for {{Planet}}, {{Moon}}, {{System}}, etc.) but should not be referenced in the main body of articles. CC7567 (talk) 20:20, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

Proposed addendum

Under the Infobox section of the Layout Guide, the following would be added as a sub-bullet at the end of the list following, "All infobox material must be detailed in the article proper, with the following exceptions:"

→See [[Forum:CT Archive/Utilizing Atlas grid coordinates (under the assumption that this CT passes]]

Adopt addendum to Layout Guide

  1. CC7567 (talk) 20:20, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  2. Stake black msg 20:24, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  3. In both of their comments, Wallace and Fry each said they basically interpret the coordinates as OOU. Judging from that, I believe we should too. Toprawa and Ralltiir (talk) 20:25, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  4. 1358 (Talk) 20:30, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  5. Good. Cade Calrayn GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit 20:48, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  6. <-Omicron(Leave a message at the BEEP!) 20:51, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  7. It's a shame to lose this, IMO, but we need to be honest to our readers. Corellian PremierJedi symbolThe Force will be with you always 21:53, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  8. Green Tentacle (Talk) 22:02, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  9. NaruHina Talk Anakinsolo 23:19, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  10. Rokkur Shen (talk) 23:24, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  11. Menkooroo (talk) 00:27, February 8, 2013 (UTC)
  12. Per Tope. —MJ— War Room 00:54, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  13. Even if these were in-universe, I'd vote for this exception. I think our requirement to include all infobox information in our articles often does a disservice to them, and finding a place to announce the grid coordinates of every system, planet, and star would in particular be a stylistic nuisance. That said, the ambiguously-OOU nature of the grid coordinates makes their removal from the text essential for reasons beyond writing quality. jSarek (talk) 07:37, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  14. 501st dogma(talk) 12:59, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  15. grunny@wookieepedia:~$ 16:32, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  16. —Cal JediInfinite Empire (Personal Comm Channel) 17:33, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  17. Yay snowball! -- Darth Culator (Talk) 18:19, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
  18. ~SavageBOB sig 02:42, February 10, 2013 (UTC)
  19. Commander Code-8 G'day, mate 08:17, February 12, 2013 (UTC)
  20. Ayrehead02 (talk) 18:41, February 14, 2013 (UTC)
  21. Exiled Jedi Oldrepublic crest (Greetings) 00:50, February 22, 2013 (UTC)

Do not adopt addendum to Layout Guide

Discussion

  • Assuming this passes, would the coordinates already existing in article bodies need to be removed? I know of at least one GA which uses them. Corellian PremierJedi symbolThe Force will be with you always 21:53, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
    • Yes, that would be the case, since the policy would need to be implemented site-wide. CC7567 (talk) 21:54, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
  • I have a question. In some cases, other sourcebooks or even novels proceeded to use the coordinates as canonical information. In such cases, can we add the coordinates in the body and ref it to the Atlas? Winterz (talk) 14:08, February 13, 2013 (UTC)
    • That might negate what Fry and Wallace said as their intentions. In other words, despite what they intend, this might be evidence that the coordinates are in-universe. What sources are you referring to? ~SavageBOB sig 14:10, February 13, 2013 (UTC)
      • The only source that I know of that uses the grid coordinates is The Essential Reader's Companion, and since that was an OOU-written work, I don't think it would negate their comments. Winterz might know of some other pulibcations, but since the Atlas is so recent I don't think there are very many, if at all. CC7567 (talk) 04:21, February 14, 2013 (UTC)
        • The Essential Guide to Warfare uses them, too, but only in maps as far as I remember. Hopefully Winterz can indicate whether she knows of other sources that use them. I mean, if there's a Dark Horse comic out there that has Luke saying, "Head to the planet Fofleo, grid coordinates N-12!" that's something we should consider. :) ~SavageBOB sig 18:47, February 14, 2013 (UTC)
          • Sorry for the delay but apparently I was mistaken. I was sure of it, but when I re-checked my supposed sources, the coordinates were not alike the ones from the Atlas. I still have a few others sources which I wanted to check, but for the most part, ignore this comment. Winterz (talk) 16:38, February 17, 2013 (UTC)