Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations/Darth Malak

< Wookieepedia:Featured article nominations
The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was unsuccessful. Please do not modify it.

Darth Malak

  • Nominated by: Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:05, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
  • Nomination comments: Hope it passes, nomed for FA per suggestion.

(1 Inqs/4 Users/5 Total)

Support

  1. Yup, it's good enough for me.--Kreivi Wolter 08:22, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
  2. LordDeathRay (My Sith Holocron) 01:25, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
  3. --Darth Jadious 13:48, October 6, 2009 (UTC)
  4. Inqvote Hopefully everyone else will get whatever I've missed. CC7567 (talk) 16:21, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
    I think it's been a long time coming. --Thenorthernman 15:23, December 19, 2009 (UTC) (Vote stricken per policy --Xd1358 16:11, December 19, 2009 (UTC))
    It's concise, complete and offers good information, it's a really good article.Te Shukalaryc Mand'alorJaingHead 23:01, February 5, 2010 (UTC) (Vote stricken per policy --Nayayen—TALK 23:11, February 5, 2010 (UTC))
  5. I don't see why not--Celtic22 17:20, February 7, 2010 (UTC)

Object

  1. Bout time this thing got moving, methinks
    • Please clarify in the intro what you mean by "known Republic space." It's not very clear.
      • I think it's good, try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Please check your linking throughout the intro. It seems that there's underlinking as far as events. Also, it appears that Malak's own flagship requires an article stub; please link and create one.
      • Malak's flagship is complete, I'll check for more links as the review goes on…--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Watch underlinking throughout the article article. A lot of articles weren't linked. Furthermore, throughout the body, please check underlinking both in general and specifically for events.
      • Same as above.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Since there's an ongoing objection for this below, I'll strike these. CC7567 (talk) 20:35, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Please try to reword the third paragraph in "Recruiting for the Revanchists." There's a lack of flow with "His reaction was this," "he did that," and it's rather play-by-play.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Please try to shorten it a bit more. Also, the verb tense in "Alek reminded Carrick that the threat of the Sith was over decades ago" isn't working. CC7567 (talk) 23:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Please shorten the fourth paragraph or rewrite it so that it's more related to Malak.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:37, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Still remains. Please shorten it more unless you believe that every single detail currently there is absolutely necessary to the reader's understanding of Malak. CC7567 (talk) 23:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
          • I think I shortened it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 23:51, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "When Demagol came to take her, he volunteered himself to be studied in her place and insisted that he had some abilities that Demagol had yet to discover." I'm not sure who the indirect pronouns are referring to. This is also something to check for when you go through the article.
    • Please cut down on your dash usage. There are many places where commas would suffice.
      • OK, have to admit, I am a little emdash happy. Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 23:51, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
        • I'm striking this for now, but I will be checking it in following reviews. CC7567 (talk) 23:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • I would recommend spacing images better; particularly, the two in the short "Against the Jedi Covenant" don't balance with the previous, lengthy section that contains only one.
    • "When Adasca asked Alek if he should entrust the exogorths to the Jedi, Alek stated that it was not a bad idea, which shocked Jarael. He then told Jarael that the Revanchists saw heartache and chaos in the years to come, stating that as the reason why Revan sent him to the meeting." I have no idea who you refer to when you're saying "he" and "him".
    • "He then deactivated the weapon, allowing the discussion to continue, and also expressed disbelief that Mandalore would offer Adasca a powerful position in the Mandalorian war effort in exchange for the device controlling the exogorths, as well as Admiral Karath for offering Republic territory for the device." Same as above. Also, the "as well as" does not make sense.
    • "Alek was shocked that Draay would deny them passage just to get to Carrick, but the arrival of the Moomo Williwaw, the starship of the Ithorian bounty hunters Dob and Del Moomo, intervened." The "intervened" does not make sense, especially since it's used as a verb in relation to "arrival".
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:32, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
        • "Arrival...crashed into the Legacy": this still does not make sense; "arrival" is not a subject that can crash or even move, for that matter. CC7567 (talk) 23:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Overall, please check for awkward wording and choppiness throughout the article.
    • I'll continue the review starting with "Masks" later. CC7567 (talk) 01:33, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
  2. Going back and scrutinizing before continuing
    • Please check for underlinking throughout the article, specifically for events. I'm trying to stress its importance by reiterating this objection because it appears to be a major chunk missing from the article, and this article isn't going to pass in its current state. Was the defeat of the Jedi Covenant linked to a specific event? Did Malak's defeat of Revan occur during a specific event as well? I'm quite sure that "Malak and Revan fought each other" and "Darth Bandon, whom Revan and his companions had previously killed" should be linked as well, and all of that's only in the intro. This is a serious lack of information, so please go through the article again and check for this.
      • I will. I linked Vindication to the Covenant's defeat, the duel between Revan and Malak on board Leviathan is already linked in the previous sentence, under "intercepted". There is no article for the duel between Revan and Bandon.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
        • If the duel between Revan and Bandon does not have an article, it should. From what I can see, there isn't a reason not to create the article unless you can enlighten me with one. CC7567 (talk) 18:39, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
          • I don't know if I could, since it hasn't been canonically established where Revan fought Bandon, and pics really can't be included, since I can't hide Revan's appearance.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:52, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
            • Pictures aren't required to make an article. You can simply create a stub for it; as long as it's linked and has an article (not necessarily a complete one), then it should be fine. CC7567 (talk) 20:35, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
              • OK, then, before I create the article, I want to ask about something. Does Wookieepedia presume that Revan searched for the Star Maps in this order: Tatooine-Kashyyyk-Manaan-Korriban? Because if so, then I can list that Nord was defeated on Tatooine, Bandon was defeated on Manaan, and I could essentially name said duel between Bandon and Revan "Duel on Hrakert Station". Plus, I could add the dialogue options which has Bandon explaining to Revan how he got down to the station, in Bandon's article.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:53, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
                • Article created.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:47, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
                  • I'm going to wait on this one until this is resolved. CC7567 (talk) 02:30, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
                    • I believe this objection has been take care of, all events are linked.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:49, September 27, 2009 (UTC)
    • Is there a particular reason why throughout the article, "Alek" is being used instead of "Squinquargesimus"? I'm not familiar with KotOR that much, but please state your reasoning as to why his last name isn't being used for formality.
      • One of the Agricorps told me in the GA process for this article that I could use Alek, I actually was going to bring this up. If you feel it's needed, I'll change it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Right now, I'm not asking you to change it, but I'm asking why it's this way—as in, I'm asking for the reasoning behind this besides the fact that an AC told you that it was okay. Last names are used for formality, and I cannot see why this should be an exception. CC7567 (talk) 18:39, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Changed all references to "Squinquargesimus".--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
          • I'd still like to know why it was "Alek" in the first place, if there was a reason. CC7567 (talk) 20:35, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
            • I think it was because, Alek was his real name, Squinquargesimus was just an add-on, Alek mentions this in issue 31.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:53, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
              • Ugh. Since I don't know enough information, I'm going to trust your judgment to make a decision on this; if Alek is his real name, then technically that should be used throughout the article, but it depends on the circumstances of ""Squinquargesimus". It would be good if you could explain yourself a little better and clarify this before making a decision. CC7567 (talk) 08:23, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "the two twisted the allegiance of the Revanchists and Republic forces": I can't tell if you mean "Revanchist and Republic forces" or "the Revanchists and the Republic forces", but please reword for clarity.
    • "Convinced that his former Master had died, Malak usurped his mantle": so suddenly Revan is Malak's former Master when just one sentence ago, he was his Master? The third paragraph of the intro as well has the same problem. Also, I can't tell who you're referring to when you say "his mantle".
    • "It would not be long until the new Dark Lord of the Sith was proven wrong about his former Master's death." It's grammatically correct, but it's slightly awkward phrasing with the "proven wrong". Perhaps "proven wrong about his beliefs on his former Master's death"?
    • "and an amnesiac Revan, whose identity as the Dark Lord": the Dark Lord, or a Dark Lord? I'm not entirely familiar about how Revan and Malak ruled, so I'm leaving you to check if this is correct.
      • It's correct, Revan was the only Dark Lord of the Sith in the Sith Empire, 'til Malak betrayed him, that is.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "After Malak revealed to his former Master that he was indeed the former Dark Lord": it sounds like Malak revealed that he himself was the "former Dark Lord" to Revan. Please reword for clarity.
      • Taken care of, I believe.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
        • Still remains. I'm asking you to reword the "he" in "After Malak revealed to Revan that he was indeed the former Dark Lord". CC7567 (talk) 18:39, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "People from Quelii did not have surnames, only names of their home villages; after he escaped Quelli when the Mandalorians devastated the world, the name of his home village was used as his surname on the immigration records." I would suggest rewording this because it appears to be just a simple side fact, and right now the chronology is rather murky and undefined in relation to his life at the village.
    • "Alek's desire to learn more": I can't tell if you mean "learn more than Revan" or "learn more than what he already knew", as in "furthering his own knowledge". Please reword for clarity.
    • "the Jedi Council urged patience and strictly forbade action, feeling that the true threat had not yet emerged": urged patience for who? Strictly forbade action from what? What was this threat that was not the "true threat"? All of this is unspecific, so please clarify. If the source didn't directly state it, try to word around it so that there aren't empty spaces in the sentence like this.
    • I'm just going to go ahead here and post all the events that sound like they deserve to be linked so that you don't miss anything. From these, please link what you can and clarify what cannot be linked and why.
      • "by participating in a scouting mission along the Outer Rim, just prior to the Mandalorian invasion of the Republic"
        • I'll see if I can get some info, don't think there's enough, though.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
          • Invasion's been linked. I really couldn't find any info on the scouting mission, just that they ended up captured on Suurja.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:19, September 23, 2009 (UTC)
      • I would particularly check the second paragraph of "Recruiting for the Revanchists" and see if there's anything that has enough info to deserve an event article.
        • I really couldn't find anything that needed to be linked in this particular paragraph.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:42, September 26, 2009 (UTC)
      • "Alek was captured in an ambush before the fourth battle of Suurja by the Mandalorians": unless it took place during the fourth battle, the ambush requires its own article if there's enough info.
        • I don't think there's enough info for this. It appeared in a panel in issue 6, and was mentioned in issue 9.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
          • There would have to be much less info for this not to deserve an article. Please explain your reasoning. CC7567 (talk) 03:30, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
      • "fought Cassus Fett at Jaga's Cluster, and defeated much of the Mandalorian army at Althir": I have the NEC right here in front of me and cannot see why these do not have articles. CC7567 (talk) 19:20, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
      • "Despite Nord's galaxy-wide reputation, he did not survive his next encounter with Revan." Please clarify if there's enough info. CC7567 (talk) 19:20, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
        • There is enough info, I've actually got the article ready to upload, just waiting for the results here, then I'll create it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:38, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
          • Please note that I'm still waiting for final clarification from you on any of these that are unstricken. CC7567 (talk) 20:57, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "the Jedi were supposed to defend against the Sith": defend what? Please check this.
    • "Alek laughed and said that the Mandalorians could have their boots at the Masters' throats, but to get them to notice the Mandalorians, they would have to paint their heads and babble about the dark side." Could you shorten this? It doesn't seem to be anything more than a side joke that doesn't serve a very big purpose.
    • "Sometime before Alek and the Revanchists came to Taris": please check your tense throughout this entire paragraph. The paragraph's placement in the article (and its tense as well) suggests that it took place after Alek conferred with Carrick, but its content suggests otherwise, and I have no idea which one is correct. Please clarify.
      • I think I've taken care of it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 19:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Demagol wanted to waste no time in testing Jarael due to her unusual Arkanian features": this is rather awkward wording, especially with the use of "wanted" in the sentence, which suggests that there was someone that had authority over Demagol and prevented him from testing Jarael. Please reword it.
    • "it was revealed that the Demagol that had emerged was actually Carrick": "the Demagol" in particular is unclear. Please reword this, perhaps to "it was revealed that Carrick was posing as Demagol" or something.
    • "Due to Demagol's mad experiments, doctors informed Alek that his hair would not grow back completely." With Demagol in the sentence, the "his hair" can refer to either him or Alek. Please clarify.
    • I'll have to continue this with "Adasca's plot and return to Taris". I know that I said I was going to continue with "Masks", but I was admittedly skimming in the previous review. I'll pick up the review again soon. CC7567 (talk) 21:10, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Until I start "Masks": "Carrick, who had left Taris with a Jedi Knight and the Shadow Celeste Morne": "a Jedi Knight"? Who? Please clarify. CC7567 (talk) 03:30, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "They met with the two Jedi Knights and their fellow Revanchists, and told them abandon their efforts and disperse permanently, feeling that the Mandalorians were not a threat, and that nothing warranted the Jedi's aid." It's initially unclear who "they" refers to; I would feel better if you clarified it. Also, this sentence is a slight run-on and rather choppy.
    • "a Mandalorian mask under his feet": under whose feet? If you mean Malak's, I would recommend saying that "he realized that he was standing on a mask" or "noticed a mask that was under his feet".
    • "Revan decided to take up her cause and donned her mask, vowing not to remove it until there was justice, until the Mandalorians were defeated once and for all": what exactly was her cause? Also, the last part of the sentence is choppy, and unless you're trying to go for an extremely "dramatic effect", please reword one of the uses of "until".
      • Taken care of, for the most part. I don't see anything wrong with trying to be a little dramatic. But if it's an issue, I'll try rewording the "untils".--Jedi Kasra (talk) 20:12, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
        • This is an encyclopedic article, not a fantasy storybook. Please reword it. CC7567 (talk) 02:30, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "A few months after the events of Vindication, Zayne Carrick, now a free man, was participating in the Tandem Open—a swoop-dueling event organized on Jervo's World, a large network of swoop-dueling arenas, above the world of Pantolomin." Unless you're going to use this as "Carrick was…when" or a similar phrase, you're using the wrong tense here. Please fix this, as I'm not sure what you mean.
    • If you can shorten the first paragraph of "Confrontation with Rohlan Dyre" slightly, it would ease the flow; it's slightly rambing right now.
    • There's a lot of play-by-play in the second paragraph of the same section. Please vary all the "Malak said this," "Malak said that."
    • "They pulled Malak off Dyre, which calmed him down." Calmed who down?
    • To a certain point, there's also some p-b-p and choppiness in the last paragraph of "Confrontation". Please do some rephrasing.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 20:12, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
        • I can only see that you've removed one phrase and changed the pronouns around; that's not rephrasing in the truest sense. Please do something more if you can. CC7567 (talk) 02:30, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
          • Please note that this still hasn't been addressed. CC7567 (talk) 20:57, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
    • As a note: if image captions are not complete sentences, then they theoretically should not have periods, which is why I've removed the ones you've replaced. Also, please do not use the term "unidentified" in an OOU article. I'll continue with "The final battles" soon. CC7567 (talk) 08:23, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Please reword "going on the attack"; it's colloquial and rather unspecific. CC7567 (talk) 02:30, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Malak and Revan changed much from the idealistic men that had first broken away from the Jedi Council": I know that you explain this in the following sentences, but you don't relate this sentence to the others. Please reword and rephrase it so that it flows better.
    • "The battle resulted in catastrophic losses on both sides. In the end, many Jedi were twisted to the dark side, and the once proud Mandalorian clans were crippled, just as Revan had intended." Please find some other way of stating the battle's results and consequences rather than the extremely blatant "The battle resulted in".
    • "After the final battle of Malachor V": is this supposed to be the "final battle of the war" or the "final battle of Malachor V"? You don't mention any other battles on Malachor V, and therefore this doesn't make sense.
    • "After the final battle of Malachor V, Revan constructed HK-47, an assassin droid." This has no immediate relevancy to the article, and unless it does, please find some other way of mentioning it in relation to Malak. You don't have to state every single thing when it happens unless it's entirely relevant to Malak.
      • I think it is relevant, since Malak did want her killed, according to HK in The Sith Lords.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:04, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Avoiding detection by the Jedi": I thought at this point, Revan and Malak were Jedi? Please reword for clarity.
    • "Malak warned Revan of the consequences": what consequences?
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:02, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
        • I still can't tell why you're avoiding this. Was one of the consequences death? A severed connection to the Force? Or was this simply not clarified by any source? CC7567 (talk) 20:57, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
          • How about now?--Jedi Kasra (talk) 04:38, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
            • "feeling that if they examined the Star Map, the Jedi would banish both he and Revan": please clarify what "Jedi" you're referring to, since Revan and Malak still appear to be Jedi. CC7567 (talk) 20:07, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
              • OK, put in "Jedi Order". Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 00:23, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Malak followed his Master in his wake": this comes out of nowhere with no clarification or explanation as to how it happened.
      • I'll take care fo this one soon, CC.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 00:23, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
    • "Though the order in which they did so is unknown": if this is an IU article, this is a huge no-no. Do not state what is unknown unless it's to something in-universe, not to the reader. Please find a way to word around this.
    • "Malak and Revan had both visited Korriban at least once when they were known as Jedi": this "known to" phrase is unspecific since it's not defined who it was "known to". Basically, the entire last paragraph of "In search of the Star Forge" is talking from an OOU perspective. Please find a way to reword it.
    • "and of the disruptor field that had caused their ship to crash": whose ship?
    • "After having gained their trust, the Elders gave Revan and Malak access to the temple." It would be Revan and Malak that had to "gain [the Elders'] trust", not the other way around. Please reword this.
    • Please clarify what you mean by "known space".
    • "During Malak's time as Revan's apprentice, he asked HK-47 what he thought of him. The droid informed Malak of his "meatbag status," and Revan found the term amusing, programming HK-47 to call all organics such." I cannot see why this is in Malak's article aside from simple humor, which does not constitute its inclusion. Unless you have a better reason for this and can clarify how it's directly related to Malak, please remove it.
    • "At some in 3,958 BBY": please check this.
    • Please clarify when Malak (and Revan, possibly as well) takes the title of "Darth". The change should be clear and should not have to be clarified.
    • "Darth Malak assumed command of the Sith Empire": what Sith Empire? Please link it. Also, you should have mentioned that Revan and Malak built an Empire earlier in the article. I can't see why it's mentioned this late when Revan and Malak have already declared war on the Republic and Jedi.
    • "After Revan was retrained in the Jedi ways, the Enclave ordered them to search for the Star Forge." I can't tell if this is where Revan's Jedi training is supposed to be, but the subject/plural agreement here isn't working.
    • "Despite Nord's galaxy-wide reputation" as what?
    • "Despite Nord's galaxy-wide reputation, he did not survive his next encounter with Revan." So he encountered Revan twice? The first isn't specified.
    • "Sometime before Revan and his crew found the fourth Star Map, Malak and his Sith forces attacked Dantooine." Please move this so that the article has better and proper chronology.
    • Overall, please check the rest of the article for clarity; the article should be clear enough to the point that I shouldn't have to ask you to clarify anything. I'll continue with "Revelation on the Leviathan" later. CC7567 (talk) 19:20, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
      • Please note that there are still a few objections currently remaining. I'll pick up the review soon, but after I go through the article completely, I'm going to be running through this again with you to flesh out all the other discrepancies that I might have missed. My recommendation is still the same—that you check the rest of the article for clarity before I review it. CC7567 (talk) 20:57, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
  3. Recurring clone attack
    • Again, I'm going to reiterate that there are still objections remaining above. I'm not sure if you just haven't had the time or if you haven't noticed them, but please try to fix them soon.
      • No, I haven't had that much time on my hands. My laptop's been KO'd by tech issues, so I'm using the library's computer's once more.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • Basically the entire first two paragraphs are not directly related to Malak, and there's too much detail in them. Please see if you can shorten them; it's reading like an article of the battle rather than on Malak.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:53, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
        • Still remains, and I do not see much "shortening". Please clarify just why this much Malak-unrelated detail is needed. CC7567 (talk) 06:46, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
          • I shortened it some, please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:50, September 21, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Sometime after Karath left, the Ebon Hawk crew member that Revan chose to break him and the rest of the crew out of the Sith's detention level managed to free them all." The crew member needs an article, and this whole sentence is unclear. How did Revan choose a crew member to help them, and why would a crew member help them?
      • I'll take care of the sentence, but I believe that there was on the article for this character, but it was ultimately deleted. The article was called "Leviathan prison break agent". I couldn't locate a log on why it was deleted, somebody here probably knows where it is. I'll see if I can find it, I personally don't see why it can't be recreated, per the Dxun Force Adept.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • Article created: Leviathan prison break agent.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 21:44, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • "She confirmed the fact, saying she was part of the Jedi strike team sent to capture him." Please check your tense. It sounds like Revan was being captured right then and there.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • Just a note: "confirm to <someone>" is rather bad and improper English. CC7567 (talk) 06:25, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • Please rephrase "end his former Master"; it's not very clear.
    • "Malak had always regretted betraying his Master from afar, but had now been given a second chance to prove himself." Please somehow rephrase this so that it's more related to the current state of events. I see no reason why it's in here except to serve as unnecessary trivia, since you're not linking it to the events or clarifying how it's relevant.
      • Good point. Removed.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • The first paragraph in "Training Bastila Shan" is extremely redundant in wording, and overall, the phrasing is very boring. Please do something about this.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • "The true reason Malak chose Shan to be his apprentice was the advantage the Sith Empire could gain from her battle meditation." Please somehow link this into the rest of the text. Blatant statements like this often sound like unnecessary trivia. CC7567 (talk) 06:25, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
          • You can take a look at it, I think I need to remove it outright, but if it's OK I'll leave it be.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:27, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • "at three hundred percent of what the Sith army projected": projected? Please clarify; I don't understand what you mean.
    • "When the Jedi penetrated their defenses": "they" who?
    • Do we know who this Dark Jedi is? Can he/she get an article?
      • I don't see why he should get an article; he only appeared twice, and both times on the Star Forge with Malak.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • ...I don't understand your reasoning. If he's confirmed to be the same character that appears twice, I see no reason that he should not get an article. CC7567 (talk) 06:25, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • I don't think you've ever clarified how or even if the Star Forge can make battle droids. Please do so.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • Please do so earlier at the earliest place possible and relevant. I can't see any reason to do so all the way down there when you already mention the Star Forge battle droids before but never clarify it. CC7567 (talk) 06:25, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Malak was at first surprised that any Jedi could stand against an army of Star Forge droids": the "any" does not seem to be the right word here, as it leaves the plural in speculation. Please try to rephrase this.
      • Took care of the "any".--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • There are way too many "then"s and other words that are providing an extremely unnecessary sense of chronology. I've removed some, but please regulate your use of them.
    • "Revan managed to stop the droids from attacking": from attacking what?
    • "Malak surmised that Revan would be a far greater asset to him than even Shan and her battle meditation. He then theorized that perhaps Revan was too powerful to be his apprentice, and that when and if Revan became stronger than him, Revan would betray him, as he himself had betrayed Revan. The former Dark Lord said that he would never turn to the dark side again, which Malak said were foolish words." This is very close to—if not already—rambling and vested with pbp. Please shorten these details.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:53, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
        • I see no change to this paragraph except a modification to a reference note. CC7567 (talk) 06:46, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
    • The same issue with the entire last paragraph of "Final confrontation and death," with the addition of more redundant wording. Kasra, I've read other sections of your article that have been much better than this, and I know you can do better.
      • Try it now.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 23:13, September 15, 2009 (UTC)
        • I'm striking this for now, but the unspecific pronouns and lack of clarity mentioned in the objection below still prevent this one from being properly satisfied. Please take care of this as soon as possible. CC7567 (talk) 07:27, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
    • Throughout this entire section, I never have any idea of who you're trying to refer to with "he", with a few exceptions. Please reword for clarity.
    • What "previous duels"? Has that ever been clarified?
      • Yes, there was the one in which Revan sliced off Malak's jaw, (no info on it other than that) and the one on Leviathan.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Although Malak was gone, Revan's final duel with him would not be the last anyone ever saw of him." I don't know who you mean by "him".
    • "Shortly thereafter, the Jedi Exile left the known galaxy in search of Revan to help him combat the "True Sith", after she defeated Darth Traya and her Sith Triumvirate." Your wording in terms of chronology is unclear here. Also, is this even necessary or relevant to Malak's article?
      • You know, you're right. Removed.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • "in case Malak failed to conquer the galaxy": please clarify why this is in there. It's not making sense, and I can't see why you're linking this to "Revan's original goals".
      • Removed, not relevant.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:46, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • Please check "obvious compared."
    • "it showed its heart": what showed his heart?
    • The fourth paragraph of "Legacy" isn't very coherent and can be worded slightly better.
    • Looking back at all of the objections I just made, I'm noticing that I'm still having to ask you to reword a lot for clarity. If I get the chance, I may finish this review tomorrow, but I don't want to have to object to the same things. If that's the case, then I'm going to hold off until you can check the rest of the article. When you get the chance, I strongly urge you to read through the P&T, P&A, and Bts to make sure that I won't have to ask you to clarify anything else. CC7567 (talk) 08:01, September 6, 2009 (UTC)
      • Alright, I think I might have killed these issues. I'm not entirely sure, though, please take a look.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:53, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
        • Some of the above still remain, and many also remain from past reviews. Please double-check them. CC7567 (talk) 06:46, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
          • I'll make sure I do.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:25, September 20, 2009 (UTC)
    • Please double-check your tense in the second paragraph of "Final confrontation and death". The current wording suggests that Malak's draining of the Jedi's life forces took place concurrently with the duel, which is unsupported by the current context of the article. Even if the tense is correct, please take note that it's unclear and take action accordingly. CC7567 (talk) 06:46, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
      • I think it's taken care of.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:25, September 20, 2009 (UTC)
        • I still can't tell which tense or timeframe is supposed to be correct, because the context still suggests that it should be worded as "had been", as in he "had been draining their Force energy". Please clarify here so that I can help you word it better. CC7567 (talk) 20:37, September 20, 2009 (UTC)
          • OK, I appreciate the help. See, Malak had been allowing the Star Forge to corrupt the Jedi's energy. After explaining this to Revan, he immediately, then and there, drained the one Jedi's energy.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:29, September 21, 2009 (UTC)
            • If Malak had already captured the Jedi and had been draining their energy, the tense should reflect that. Also, that Jedi whose energy Malak drained should get an article. CC7567 (talk) 06:50, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
              • Malak captured the Jedi, but as far as I know, did not use any of their reserve evergy until his and Revan's duel. No canonical proof that he used them anytime before this. How would I title such an article? Would this work? Unidentified Jedi (Star Forge's observation deck)--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:19, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
                • Article created: Unidentified captive Jedi.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:35, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
                  • The article was deleted by Chack Jadson, so it must not be relevant.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:38, September 25, 2009 (UTC)
    • Please structure your P&T better. For starters, the note about his humor is smack right in the middle of a paragraph dedicated to his anti-Council beliefs, and it simply does not fit. Please check for this throughout the section.
      • I couldn't find an appropriate paragraph to stick this with, so I removed it. Please take a look at the section.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:07, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Malak knew that he would face this dilemma, the horrors of the war were not a mystery to Malak." You're improperly linking two independent clauses here, and I have no idea what you mean, what you're trying to say, or how you're trying to relate them.
    • For future reference, it's very bad form to involve the reader in the article by including "you" or "your" in an encyclopedic article; it's both unnecessary and unspecific, since it's never clear who the "you" is talking to. I highly recommend ceasing your usage of it.
    • I would consider merging "Training Bastila" with another section. As it stands, one skimpy paragraph does not warrant its own section if you're trying to be consistent in size. However, please note that this one is a suggestion, not an objection.
      • I'll take that suggestion. I merged it with the "Revelation on the Leviathan" section, please see what you think.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:07, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
    • There are too many "capable"s in the P&A. Please find alternatives rather than using the same wording over and over.
      • There's only two in the P&A section, should I omit one of them?--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:07, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
        • My mistake; it's "could," not "capable," that's being overused. CC7567 (talk) 21:00, September 26, 2009 (UTC)
          • Take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 22:27, September 26, 2009 (UTC)
            • If I previously object to a phrase and ask you to remove it, that usually means that it should not be used again. Please see my objection to the "known to" wording above. CC7567 (talk) 22:34, September 26, 2009 (UTC)
    • For now, that's all I have. I will be going through the entire article again with you shortly to make sure that nothing is missed. CC7567 (talk) 06:50, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
      • Thanks for this first review, CC.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 13:07, September 24, 2009 (UTC)
        • Before I start my second review, I'd like to again reiterate that any unstricken objections have either not been addressed or have not received clarification if you've addressed them. CC7567 (talk) 21:00, September 26, 2009 (UTC) -->
  4. Attack II
    • If you're going to include the "as Darth Malak" for his affiliation to the Sith, you're going to have to be consistent and do the same for the other affiliations.
    • Can anything about his regrets before death be included in the intro?
      • I don't see how. Plus, it really isn't relevant to the intro, in my opinion.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:55, October 10, 2009 (UTC)
    • Is the "honorary Master" currently at its earliest possible/relevant mention?
    • Reading this over and over, I cannot see why the Jedi Covenant's vision even belongs where it is now. In the current tense, it excessively implies that it was directly related to Malak. It should be mentioned where it first becomes relevant, and it is not relevant in its current location.
    • The current level of detail for the vision is also inappropriate. You're going to have to provide a very good argument as to why, particularly, the red enviro-suits and Rogue Moon should be in there. All that needs to be said is that they misinterpreted a prophecy of their own deaths and believed that their Padawans were responsible for it.
    • "regarding Adasca's meeting from Vamm": please check this; the "meeting from Vamm" isn't proper English.
    • I'm getting tired of reading all your usages of "who was" throughout "Adasca's plot and return to Taris". Please check if all the facts that you link them to are entirely necessary and do some rewording.
      • What do you mean? There's only one "who was" in this entire section.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:55, October 10, 2009 (UTC)
    • Will resume soon with "Against the Jedi Covenant". CC7567 (talk) 21:25, October 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Despite Squinquargesimus' assurances of clearing Carrick's name": this is improper English. As you're the one who knows what you're trying to say, please be clearer.
    • "and that nothing warranted the Jedi's aid in the Mandalorian Wars": aid to whom? It sounds like you're trying to say "involvement" here.
      • I am, so it's in and "aid" is out.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:21, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
    • "The four men who expressed interest in Jarael in reality": please check this; I cannot tell where the "in reality" is supposed to go, but its current placement is improper.
    • "told her that the reason for that": reason for what?
    • "As the war progressed, Malak and Revan changed from the idealistic men that had first rebelled against the Jedi Council." If you're going to use this phrasing, you're going to have to clarify what they changed to.
      • I'll take care of this soon, CC.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:21, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
        • Taken care of, I believe. Did some rearranging.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 22:23, October 22, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Developing a cold, calculating disposition that was uncharacteristic of Jedi, "moral shortcuts" became common practice under Revan and Malak's leadership, as did a number of other unsavory acts." This sounds like the "moral shortcuts" developed the cold, calculating disposition.
      • I rearranged this a bit, please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:21, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
    • "If a world had no strategic significance, then it had no significance, regardless of the cost in sentient life." The "cost in sentient life" is phrased awkwardly, and its inclusion in the sentence isn't verified. If a world didn't have any significance, then what did Revan and Malak do to it? Please clarify directly.
      • After merging two of the paragraphs, this sentence seemed contradictory to the tone of the paragraph. Please take a look at it and advise.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:21, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Revan intended to unleash": I can't remember if I've already discussed this with you, but you don't clarify if he actually did or not. Please do so.
      • No, he didn't actually activate it, the Jedi Exile did. I believe the necessary info is in this section's final paragraph. I also did some rearranging of the third paragraph.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:21, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
    • Will continue with "In search of the Star Forge". CC7567 (talk) 07:23, October 19, 2009 (UTC)
    • Can you clarify the placement of the Star Forge search? The content leading up to it suggests that it took place after the war, but the verb tense and content of the section itself says otherwise.
      • Not sure if it's completely fixed, but you can try it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 15:31, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
        • If you're not completely confident that you've fixed it, chances are that you haven't. If the search for the first star map took place during the Mandalorian Wars, then the article needs to reflect that. CC7567 (talk) 02:10, October 28, 2009 (UTC)
          • Cut out the "In search of the Star Forge" section, and moved image and info to "The final battles". Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 18:25, October 28, 2009 (UTC)
            • Your clarification of the necessity to find the Star Maps to locate the Forge needs to come at the earliest place of relevancy, as I've been asking you to do throughout this whole review. It isn't initially clear why Revan and Malak went to look for them. CC7567 (talk) 02:53, October 30, 2009 (UTC)
              • Got it. Did some rearranging; I put this sentence in the third paragraph of "The final battles": The Star Map was necessary to uncover the secret location of the Star Forge, a relic of the Rakatan Infinite Empire that had ruled the galaxy approximately 20,000 standard years before. I believe this is the earliest place, especially if you take into count Malak's dialogue from the first game.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:46, October 30, 2009 (UTC)
    • "capturing the majority of the Republic fleet": it sounded like the indirect articles were switched around, since the first "the" used to be an "a," which is improper English. I changed the first one, but please check the second one to make sure it's correct.
      • Yes, it is correct. Put "the Republic's fleet" rather than "the Republic fleet".--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 15:31, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
    • That's all I have the time and energy for right now. Will continue with "Dark Lord of the Sith." CC7567 (talk) 05:08, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Committed to uniting the galaxy beneath his authority, Revan was determined to locate the Star Forge." This really doesn't make sense. Why did they want to locate the Star Forge? To use on some squabbling species that was a threat to the galaxy? To do whatever they pleased? CC7567 (talk) 03:08, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Unbeknownst to Malak, Shan saved Revan's life and brought him to the Jedi Council, where his mind was reprogrammed with the identity of a Republic soldier." The "where" does not match up here; please fix this.
    • "as he failed to capture Shan and was killed by Revan after he found a fourth Star Map": "he" who? (If it's Revan, please find some other pronoun to use instead of repeating the name excessively.)
      • Please take a look at it.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 20:23, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
        • Was he trying to find the Star Maps to track down the Star Forge, as he had done before? It's implied, but I don't believe that you clarify this directly. CC7567 (talk) 21:04, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • "The Sith Lord plundered through the ruins": ruins of what?
    • "Malak was at first surprised that a Jedi could stand against an army of Star Forge droids": I still can't make sense of what you're trying to say with this "a Jedi." You previously specify no other Jedi in this section, and it simply does not flow well. Please clarify this.
    • "Though Malak knew that his Sith troops would not kill Revan": why? Out of inability, lesser powers, or unwillingness to do so?
    • "Revan's tactics in galactic conquest included relying on the Star Forge only to a certain extent, sparing worlds with military and economic significance from the brutality of conquest, killing off political and military figures who were destabilizing the galaxy, and converting many to his cause rather than simply annihilating them outright." Please clarify how this excessive detail is necessary when you simply say "In contrast to his Sith Master Revan" a second later.
      • Taking another look at it, these details aren't relevant. Removed.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 20:23, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
    • "Because of Squinquargesimus' belief of the Jedi Order's passiveness, he joined Revan's campaign against the Mandalorians, believing that the Jedi Council would not be able to solve the conflict." Please somehow vary "belief".
    • I've had to change a ton of "Revan" and "Malak"s to other pronouns to nix the heavy redundancy, but there are still a hefty amount of repetition in the article. Please go through the article and correct this. Other than that, that's it. CC7567 (talk) 08:23, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
      • I think it's good now. I appreciate you going over the article, CC.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 20:23, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
  5. As pointed out on the discussion page, Malak was not born Squinquargesimus. It is simply the surname registered in the Republic. The sources you cite - Jedi vs. Sith: Essential Guide to the Force and the KotOR Handbook - were both published in november 2007, but KotOR issue 31, which revises his original name to simply Alek from the village Squinquargesimus, takes precedence as later canon published in july 2008. Therefore saying that he was born Alek Squinquargesimus is factually incorrect. Jediphile 17:51, December 13, 2009 (UTC)
    • Alright, I changed the intro to reflect that he was born Alek, however, it also states how he got the name Squinquargesimus attached as a surname. We can't ignore that fact. As for the article itself, it already states that he was born Alek, and also notes the immigration record's giving him the surname.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 00:38, December 14, 2009 (UTC)
      • I would like to point out to the Inqs that this objection has been taken care for over three weeks. The user has also voluntarily left Wookieepedia.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:26, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
      • Objection(s) overridden by Inquisitorius 23:03, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  6. Well, I did promise a review
    • I'd like to see some mention of him jumping from his speeder to rescue Carrick; not everyone would do that.
    • You need to get in stuff about Rohlan and Demagol's switcharoo in the bit before "The Adasca affair", it has relevance to the later parts on Coruscant.
      • Please try it. Also, could you take a look at the sections, like the P&T, the Adasca affair, the Confrontation on Wor Tandell, and Trial of Demagol sections?--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:25, January 15, 2010 (UTC)
    • Shortly after that, you say he was told that his hair would not grow back but you have not mentioned that he lost it before.
    • "...final party to the negotiations announced his arrival via transmission. As Mandalore the Ultimate, the leader of the Mandalorians..." Can you reword these two sentences so that the final party is explicitly said to be Mandalore?
    • HK's tale about Malak being the origin of "meatbag" should be worked into the paragraph that mentions HK's construction.
      • CC said it wasn't really relevant to Malak.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:25, January 15, 2010 (UTC)
        • Hmm, well I personally think opposite; it drove Malak to "extreme lengths of frustration", something that would go well in the P&T. Nayayen—TALK 20:31, January 15, 2010 (UTC)
          • OK, I added it. It's the 5th paragraph of the P&T.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 16:12, January 16, 2010 (UTC)
    • Quite a bit further down, are the Star Forge droids the same as the one in the Dantooine Star Map ruins? (I really don't remember) If they aren't, they will need an article. I suspect they are though, but I'm not sure.
      • I just linked the article for battle droids in the "Battle of Rakata Prime" section. The droids that Malak unleashes against Revan before Revan heads to the observation deck are the same as the guardian droid that Revan and Malak encountered on Dantooine.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:25, January 15, 2010 (UTC)
    • That's all I can find for now. I won't support just yet; I'll wait until the Demon arc and TOR Timelines 7 & 8 are released and you have updated the article because I might find some more. Otherwise, this is excellent stuff. Nayayen—TALK 16:54, January 14, 2010 (UTC)
      • Thanks for this first review, Nayayen.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:25, January 15, 2010 (UTC)

Comments

  • Please make sure that the placement of the images match what the article is talking about. I don't have the means to check this myself right now, but I would suggest that you do this. CC7567 (talk) 23:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Information on Malak from the upcoming Demon arc will be added when it comes out.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 00:14, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
  • I'll be busy for the next few days, but I'll take care of your objections, CC.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:58, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
  • By the way, according to the CSWE's entry on the Leviathan, Malak took command of the ship when Karath brough the ship to the Sith, so.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 12:04, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Kasra, just so you know: it's not that I've forgotten about Malak, I just haven't had a lot of time on my hands lately. I'll try and finish him up this weekend if possible. CC7567 (talk) 15:48, September 4, 2009 (UTC)
  • That's no problem, CC, I myself have been busy. Have to use the library's computers since my computer is on the fritz.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:09, September 4, 2009 (UTC)
  • Hey CC, I'll get to the remaining objections as soon as I can, kinda busy.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 14:16, September 12, 2009 (UTC)
    • A note on the "one-time" and "towards" that I have now reverted back: the former was improper usage of the "ndash"—it's already an idiom used in English and does not deserve a different dash, and the latter was slang. CC7567 (talk) 06:46, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
  • Another note, this one on the P&T paragraph that I split back again: it's often best not to have huge walls of text in the middle of articles, especially if it's a deviation from the article's standard paragraph size. CC7567 (talk) 21:00, September 26, 2009 (UTC)
  • CC, I would greatly appreciate it if you would review the information on Malak I will have to add in the coming months, from the Demon story arc.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:20, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
    • I'll try my best, but I can't promise anything. It's best if you leave comments here so that I know when future issues are released, since I won't be keeping Malak in my watchlist anymore (as I only keep FANs watched during my reviews). CC7567 (talk) 16:21, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
  • I will edit the article with info from the latest issue tomorrow.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 00:40, November 19, 2009 (UTC)
  • Malak, of course, is Part 1 of "Project: Bad Guys of KotOR". Bandon was Part 2.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 13:20, December 1, 2009 (UTC)
  • No info from final issue, but updated article with info from here.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 02:31, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

Vote to strike objection by Jediphile (Inq only)

  1. Inqvote Per nominator's request. Objection seems to have been addressed, and user has voluntarily left the Wook. CC7567 (talk) 22:39, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  2. Inqvote—Tommy 9281 Mechnochair-NEGWT (Mechno-chair) 22:43, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  3. Inqvote Jonjedigrandmaster (Jedi Beacon) 22:52, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  4. Inqvote Grunny (Talk) 22:53, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
  5. Inqvote --Eyrezer 23:02, February 8, 2010 (UTC)