Talk: Jedi Sentinel/Legends

Shaela Nuur

Does anyone know what source states Shaela Nuur as a Jedi Sentinel? I'm not arguing that it isn't out there, I'm just curious as to where it is said. Thanks. -- Master Dakari 06:41, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Well she weilded a yellow lightsaber in Shadows and Light so it's a plausible assumption based upon the era in which that comic was placed NaruHina 01:33, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Obi-Wan

Where is it established that he's a sentinel and watchman? I'm not saying it's wrong, but we need a source for that. --Jedimasterbob 20:36, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

• Jedi Watchman? Which planet did he oversee? Tatooine? Being defensive is not because he was a Jedi Watchman, but because he mastered Soresu. - TopAce 21:52, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Anakin Skywalker Sentinel

Shouldnt anakin be a sentinel He is powerful with the force and lightsaber found ballance as well has other skills such as repair and piloting. —Unsigned comment by 64.12.116.69 (talk • contribs)

• No. Only if they are identified in a canon source as a sentinel. Lonnyd 07:59, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
  • I know that since it is now 2008, and the last comment for this section was posted on 24 August 2006, this is a very late message. But: I think that Anakin has been sourced--- I forgot what source though ---as a Jedi Guardian. Cyfiero II 01:03, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

"admirable combat skill"

If a Sentinel's combat skills are admirable, what would you call a Guardian's combat skills? Whoever added this must be a great fan of the Sentinel class and it's POV and factually incorrect. When I played KotOR and had Jolee and Basile with me (when I was a Guardian), it was ALWAYS Bastila who died first. - TopAce 11:07, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

• OK, you got a point here but don't exaggerate... It's true that "admirable" is a bit too much for a Sentinel (compared to a Guardian), but in the games the Sentinel is way more formidable than the Consular regarding to hand-to-hand combat. The reason why Bastila always died first is probably because Jolee stayed back and used his force powers (Force Whirlwind and Stun tend to protect from attracting much opposition) and because you as a Guardian lasted longer than her (having better HP and stuff). Besides my player in KOTOR II was a Sentinel and he definitely wasn't the one who died first... —Unsigned comment by 87.239.237.15 (talk • contribs)
• TopAce...I think u're just a great fan of the Guardian class. It might've been POV, but just because someone said that the skills of Sentinel was "admirable", doesn't mean that they didn't think of Guardian as bein more "admirable." That person might be both a fan of Sentinel and Guardian. You don't know their POV of Guardian. I know that this doesn't have to do with change in the article. But I just can't help protecting whoever said that Sentinels were admirable because from my experience, not much people likes Sentinels. I'm a great fan of them also, but I don't think that fans who are not of Sentinels should be underestimating them. They're still Jedi afterall so they all should deserve the same respect. Cyfiero II 01:15, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

The case for Visas, and conformity

I can understand the rationale for keeping Visas as a possible, or removing her and the other KOTOR2 people altogether, but I do not agree with it. If we are going to call her Sentinel class gameplay mechanics, then we have some problems. The first being that all of these titles, all of these "classes" started as gameplay mechanics and later "evolved" into tangible, in-universe rankings. Look at our current list of Jedi Guardians; it has suddenly exploded with documented examples, and many of these examples cannot be anything other than game mechanics for roleplaying (Yun and Gorc, for instance, could not have possibly held a rank of "Guardian" in the Jedi Order). Another thing to consider is that these characters, even Atton and Mira, are destined to become Jedi. This is in accordance with Kreia's prophecy, which we have no reason to believe is false. They may not have official titles given from established Jedi Masters, but, much like those of the New Jedi Order, they are unquestionably the new Jedi. Visas Marr, particularly, is the only one of these who is already trained (as a Dark Jedi, granted), and she understands both the Force and lightsaber combat regardless of how the Exile interacts with her. It may be game mechanics that she is specifically identified as a Sentinel, but the Sentinel identity itself is first and foremost game mechanics that have been adopted into narrative. If her generation of Jedi uses those three titles (which they apparently do, as the titles exist for later Jedi like Obi-Wan), then it can only be assumed that Visas would assume this one. Even further, the Star Wars Miniatures game Jedi Sentinel is modeled off of Visas. This is why I believe she should definatively be among those listed. -BaronGrackle 02:44, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

• If Visas has Sentinel levels in-game, she should be on the list. No question. QuentinGeorge 05:06, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
  • To repeat, they're not officially members of the Jedi Order. - Sikon 07:35, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
    • To repeat: That doesn't matter. Neither was Yun. But both received training from a Jedi. QuentinGeorge 07:53, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
      • An exiled Jedi. - Sikon 08:29, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
        • As stated by Mical and even a few of the Jedi Masters themselves, "exile" was the Jedi Exile's choice. The council could not have forced her to do such a thing. But with the galaxy in such dire need of Jedi, and with there no known Masters - except a few - to train any willing Force-sensitives, the Exile had every right to forsake her sentencing and join the ranks of the Order once again. (Regardless of a few game glitches, even Vrook says at one point, "We may be the last." This statement further identifies her as a member of the Order.) Also, being a fully-trained Jedi Knight she had all the prerequisites needed to take on apprentices and train them in the way of the Jedi. And with no valid Jedi Council to forbid nor deny her decisions and actions, they go unquestioned and justified. In essence, being one of the few legitimate Jedi left in the galaxy, and the only one making any strides to bring the Order from the brink of extinction, her will was law; unopposed, and rightly so. Just as Luke Skywalker built the New Jedi Order, so too did the Jedi Exile reconstruct the old Jedi Order through the teaching of her party members, the true Jedi upon whom the future is to be built. And Visas had formal training under Darth Nihilus. Sith training, but training in the Force and lightsaber combat nonetheless. And after she joined the party of the Jedi Exile, she was redeemed and became one of the Exile's many apprentices. Visas was saved to the point of even aiding in the death of her former dark master. She is, for all intents and purposes, a legitimate Jedi by the time the game comes to a close.--Master Dakari 04:33, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
          • I know this is kind of late, but... I don't think one has to be a Jedi to be part of the three classes of Jedi Guardian, Jedi Sentinel, or Jedi Consular. It's just a class. Also, isn't it possible to name Sith as Dark Jedi Guardians, Dark Jedi Sentinels, and Dark Jedi Consulars? I know that Dark Jedi and Sith are not the same. But since Sith came from Dark Jedi, then it should apply. The three classes apply to Jedi, Sith, adn Dark Jedi. Cyfiero II 01:08, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
            • I honestly don't understand why Visas is a Sentinel...She's a Miraluka (meaning she's more adept in force usage), a lowsy fighter, and doesn't have any non-jedi skills that are worth mentioning...I'd say she's more of a Consular. And to add to the previous question: no, jedi titles don't apply to the sith classes because even though the first sith (as a force-sect) were dark jedi, they've formed their own philosophy, while dark jedi are either fallen jedi, or dark sided force users that don't belong in any "official" sith organization (at least that's mostly what this article says [[1]]). User:Shoroi 15:00, 14 January 2013 (EET)

SAGA Edition

Jedi Sentinels appear as a talent tree under the Jedi base class in SAGA edition of the Star Wars RPG. I tried to edit the article to represent that, but the edit got deleted.

• Plz sign ur message. I think that u should try it again. Cyfiero II 01:17, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

A balance between the 3 main classes?

I always thought the Sentinel, while skilled in both the ways of the Force and lightsaber combat, had no true mastery of either one.--The K.O. King 03:47, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The Guardian focuses on lightsaber mastery, the Consular focuses on Force mastery, and the Sentinel focuses on other skills. Look at it this way (based on training): (1-3)

Guardian: Lightsaber-(3) / Force-(1) / Skills-(1)

Sentinel: Lightsaber-(2) / Force-(2) / Skills-(3)

Consular: Lightsaber-(1) / Force-(3) / Skills-(1)

This may vary depending on the innate talents of each Jedi (e.g. a Consular might be good at hacking computers). Try not to look at it as game mechanics all the time, the real world isn't based on statistics so why should this. Also, the classes are simply a method of training; at school you can have compulsory lessons (Maths, Science, etc), but you can also take non-curricular lessons on the side (such as Archery or Wargames etc). Darth Raivon 15:09, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Atton as a Sentinel?

I thought that Atton Rand was a Jedi Sentinel also. Isn't it canon that the Jedi Exile trained Atton to become a Jedi? Or is that unconfirmed? If u train him to become a Jedi, he'll become a Jedi Sentinel. I think that he should be added on the list. Cyfiero II 01:20, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

• Let me paraphrase, "I think he should be added on the list," "But I'm not sure."=] Cyfiero II 07:27, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
  • It's unconfirmed that the Exile trained any of her companions to be Jedi. -- I need a name (Complain here) 11:25, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
    • Oh, ok then. Thanks, I didn't know that... Cyfiero II 08:09, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Celeste Morne as a Sentinel

I would make the case that Celeste Morne should be added as a Jedi Sentinel. We know that she was a Jedi Shadow and her function was the same as a sentinel. I tired to add her and Zayne Carrick to the list (citing sources for both) and organize the page a little bit more. But it keeps on getting reverted back. —Unsigned comment by M Brennan (talk • contribs)

• Just because it may "seem" like someone has the same function doesn't mean they are Sentinels. It has to be explicitly stated somewhere. ^Jorrel_Fraajic 01:35, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Jedi Shadow's a Sentinel specialization, so Celeste is obviously a Sentinel. Not really sure about Zayne though...I mean, he ain't a good fighter, nor is he a good force-user...but perhaps that's just the thing with sentinels: they're either potent at both + non-jedi skills, or aren't potent at either + non-jedi skills... User:Shioroi 15:18, 14 January 2013 (EET)

Revan

Revan balanced the light and the dark, so why not lightsaber and force powers? Revan is very skilled and for some time was a jedi. So, I guess it is possible Revan was a jedi sentinel.

• I don't see how balancing the light and dark can make you a sentinel...you may be a grey jedi, or a dark jedi, or a jedi master at that, so balancing the dark and light doesn't make you a sentinel...but you're right, he was skilled in saber combat, force use, and non-jedi skills alike, not to mention that he lived without the force after the council wiped his memory and fared greatly, so he must be sentinel... User:Shioroi 15:22, 14 January 2013 EET

See also

The See also section should contain the articles that are closely linked to the Sentinel, ie the Jedi Watchman, Shadow and investigator that were there prior to the changes made by Purpilia who replaced them with the unrelated Jedi Consular and the non existent Jedi Warrior. I've reverted them back, if Purpilia wishes to change them to the ones that s/he added could s/he please explain why here first. Alexsau1991 ^{(talk page)} 16:03, October 2, 2010 (UTC)

Although since the Jedi Watchman, Shadow and investigator are all subheaded in the article, I don't see the need for the see also section. Alexsau1991 ^{(talk page)} 16:07, October 2, 2010 (UTC)

• I didn't see that you had edited the talk page before I changed back the article. my reasoning for this, like I wrote in the Edit Summary, is that the Consular, Guardian, and Sentinel are each one of the three main schools of thought in the Order. Knights can puruse to study one of these paths to best hone their skills. Listed in the subheadings are each of the main specialty classes that exh of the branches can pursue to further demonstrate mastery! Alot of this is new information outlined in The Jedi Path. Hope that makes sense as to why I edited how I did! Purpilia 16:58, October 2, 2010 (UTC)

Jedi Combat - sentinel specialization?

That's just a game skill tree, not a specialization per-say...You don't have to be a sentinel to use two sabers after all...It may, however, be added to "Additional specialization" User:Shoroi 13:37, 7 February 2013 (EET)

• It means that that specific double-bladed technique is unique to the sentinels, not the ability to wield two lightsabers. NaruHina ^Talk 00:12, February 8, 2013 (UTC)

Jedi Watchman

How is it a sentinel specialization if Yoda was the Watchman of Kashyyyk and was a jedi consular, while Ki-Adi-Mundi was Watchman of the Cerean sector and was a jedi guardian? User:Shioroi 13:58, 7 February 2013 (EET)

• In KotOR2, Watchman is one of the prestige classes for the Sentinel. It doesn't say that one has to be a Sentinal to become a Watchmen, but it is considered a specialization of the class in that sense. NaruHina ^Talk 00:09, February 8, 2013 (UTC)
  • So then, I suggest we put it into the Additional Specialization section... User:Shioroi 17:15, 27 May 2013 (EET)

Meetra Surik

We know that by cannon that she wasn't a guardian (as mentioned by Kavar), and we know that she was a "mediocre jedi" (as mentioned by Vrook). She lived at least five years without the force and yet survived (we know how hard it is for a jedi to live without the force), so what if she really was a sentinel? She might have been a consular during the mandalorian wars, but she might have trained herself as a sentinel, since she was a good technician, and most probably had good demolition skills (Khoonda defences, Second Battle of Dxun (as seen in Ludo Kresh's tomb)), and again, most probable decent medical skills (healing the sick refugee). User:Shioroi 13:59, 7 February 2013 (EET)

• You're trying to prove too much from these facts, and it's become supposition. If a source doesn't say it, we don't add it. Simple as that. NaruHina ^Talk 00:11, February 8, 2013 (UTC)

Incorrect

Jedi Sentinels do not focus on other skills, they are offensive fighters in the Order, while Guardians are defensive. Answers to become a Sentinel in the KoToRs are about going out, and hunting down Sith, and their like. That is literally one of the answers to become a Sentinel is to say you would hunt evil people down. Their role is specified in their answers as being about protecting the galaxy from evil, by being on the look out for it, and going out to defeat it when they see it. That is the defining characteristics of Sentinels. There was nothing about things like picking locks, slicing, etc. (One guide bit I'm looking at right now says that only the Consulars have the Computer Use, and Demolitions skills in KoToR I, while Sentinels don't have it.) So, this entire wikia page needs to be redone. Ultimately, though, none of this KoToR stuff is canon, and it contradicts canon. (The closest to rules in Episodes 1-6 is that blue usually is wielded by a padawan, or fresh/young knight, while established Knights, and Masters typically wield green.) So, one should not get confused, and mistake it for canon, trying to apply it to the rest of EU, and even to the true canon (Episodes 1-6). (Also, many online are claiming Sentinels are diplomatic, despite that is Consulars... I think that was the KoToR II version, which completely changed Sentinels. I remember well that Sentinels in KoToR I, and KoToR II have completely different indication of what they are, and what they do. I would imagine it's because KoToR I's Sentinels sound like Sith... And, because the storyline ultimately would mean that those who left the Order over disagreement with the Council were all, or mostly Sentinels.) --174.19.244.195 12:31, April 4, 2014 (UTC)

• You're highly mistaken if you think that KOTOR & KOTOR 2 are non-canon. So what if the lightsaber colors aren't reflected in the movies; that means that by that time, 4000 years after the games, the traditions had changed. Cade Calrayn 16:51, April 4, 2014 (UTC)