Relation to Neva Kee
Pointing out in the "Behind the Scenes" section that there may be a connection between the two is perfectly appropriate for this article, given that they are both podracers who lived in the same area, where active at the same time, and who had the same last name. It's within the appropriate boundaries of speculation standards. It's no different than comparing "Drexl Roosh" with "drexl beast," which has been done. continuing to revert this addition constitutes vandalism, since it is appropriately worded and appropriately placed in the Behind the Scenes section. 98.27.213.72 01:49, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- It is not appropriate for the article, as it is speculation and original research. There are no appropriate boundaries of speculation standards on Wookieepedia, and reverting it is not vandalism at all. Menkooroo 02:04, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- From the section on original research, under "What is not original research:" "Editors may make straightforward mathematical calculations or logical deductions based on fully attributed data that neither change the significance of the data nor require additional assumptions beyond what is in the source. It should be possible for any reader without specialist knowledge to understand the deductions." This is what I mean by appropriate boundaries of speculation. I've given my reasoning here, and from that alone you can come to the logical conclusion that Habba Kee could very well be related to Neva Kee, or that, given much of Habba Kee's ambiguous canonicity, they could have been intended to be the same person. Now, from canon policy it clearly states "Except in cases of vandalism, obscenity, and other nonsense, you should not edit the article and simply delete the text" and in Vandalism it very, very clearly states that simply deleting portions of an article constitutes vandalism.98.27.213.72 03:36, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Reverting speculation is not "simply deleting portions of an article;" it's reverting speculation, which has no place in articles. What you've added to the article does require additional assumptions beyond what is in the source, as it's quite plainly assuming something that isn't in the source. It is thus speculation and original research. Wookieepedia records canon; it does not make up canon and speculate that it may be true. Menkooroo 03:51, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Also, as an anonymous editor, you are far less likely to be taken seriously then Menk, who is a well-known and respected editor on this site. Plus, see this for a further example of why we don't just randomly say "oh, this guy could be related to this guy". Cade Calrayn
03:55, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Thanks for the example, Cade. I was looking for something like that. For the record, though, anonymous editors are just as valid members of the community as well-known editors, and everyone who makes good-faith edits should be taken seriously. Menkooroo 04:05, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- I'm an anonymous editor because I stopped using my actual account years ago because I was getting sick of how much red tape and how little common sense was involved in the way Wookieepedia was run, as exemplified by conflicts like this, but I've been an on-and-off user since 2006. Regardless, the fact that they share a last name is in the source material. The fact that they were both podracers who both lived on Tattooine at the same time and were both intended to be in the Boonta at the same time establishes an even greater connection. It's not certain, but it's probable, and for that reason I say they "may" be related and put it in the "Behind the scenes" section rather than in the article proper. Now, the article for Raan Calrissian has this in the behind the scenes section: "Raan has the same surname as the character Lando Calrissian, but there is currently no canonical connection between the two." Galduran Calrissian has a similar reference. If I worded it like that, would you have a problem with it?98.27.213.72 04:12, May 1, 2012 (UTC)'
- Personally, I don't give a flying kriff what happens. The information's not that important, but neither is the article, so I'll go with what Menk says since he's been here longer. Cade Calrayn *bows to seniority* 04:23, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Seniority doesn't mean anything... and actually, I think anon guy may be onto something. If "Behind the scenes" said "Yes, they have the same last name and are in the same podrace, but no, no explicit connection was made between them..." I like it. Menkooroo 04:39, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- You're really going to make me come out of a five year retirement over Habba Kee? Bah. So are we good with that revision, then?Darth Ceratis 04:42, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah, we recently had a consensus track where we determined that saying that kind of thing in BTS is OK, as long as it's not a huge stretch. Statements where you don't connect the dots; you just point out obvious similarities and let the reader do the rest. And no need to come out of retirement id you don't want to; edits by anons are just as valid as edits by anyone else. Menkooroo 04:44, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- There. Added "He shares a surname with another podracer who took part in the Boonta Eve Classic, Neva Kee, indicating a possible relation between the two, although non has been confirmed in canon." Is this acceptable as written?Darth Ceratis 04:53, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah, we recently had a consensus track where we determined that saying that kind of thing in BTS is OK, as long as it's not a huge stretch. Statements where you don't connect the dots; you just point out obvious similarities and let the reader do the rest. And no need to come out of retirement id you don't want to; edits by anons are just as valid as edits by anyone else. Menkooroo 04:44, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- You're really going to make me come out of a five year retirement over Habba Kee? Bah. So are we good with that revision, then?Darth Ceratis 04:42, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Seniority doesn't mean anything... and actually, I think anon guy may be onto something. If "Behind the scenes" said "Yes, they have the same last name and are in the same podrace, but no, no explicit connection was made between them..." I like it. Menkooroo 04:39, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Personally, I don't give a flying kriff what happens. The information's not that important, but neither is the article, so I'll go with what Menk says since he's been here longer. Cade Calrayn
- I'm an anonymous editor because I stopped using my actual account years ago because I was getting sick of how much red tape and how little common sense was involved in the way Wookieepedia was run, as exemplified by conflicts like this, but I've been an on-and-off user since 2006. Regardless, the fact that they share a last name is in the source material. The fact that they were both podracers who both lived on Tattooine at the same time and were both intended to be in the Boonta at the same time establishes an even greater connection. It's not certain, but it's probable, and for that reason I say they "may" be related and put it in the "Behind the scenes" section rather than in the article proper. Now, the article for Raan Calrissian has this in the behind the scenes section: "Raan has the same surname as the character Lando Calrissian, but there is currently no canonical connection between the two." Galduran Calrissian has a similar reference. If I worded it like that, would you have a problem with it?98.27.213.72 04:12, May 1, 2012 (UTC)'
- Thanks for the example, Cade. I was looking for something like that. For the record, though, anonymous editors are just as valid members of the community as well-known editors, and everyone who makes good-faith edits should be taken seriously. Menkooroo 04:05, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- Also, as an anonymous editor, you are far less likely to be taken seriously then Menk, who is a well-known and respected editor on this site. Plus, see this for a further example of why we don't just randomly say "oh, this guy could be related to this guy". Cade Calrayn
- Reverting speculation is not "simply deleting portions of an article;" it's reverting speculation, which has no place in articles. What you've added to the article does require additional assumptions beyond what is in the source, as it's quite plainly assuming something that isn't in the source. It is thus speculation and original research. Wookieepedia records canon; it does not make up canon and speculate that it may be true. Menkooroo 03:51, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
- From the section on original research, under "What is not original research:" "Editors may make straightforward mathematical calculations or logical deductions based on fully attributed data that neither change the significance of the data nor require additional assumptions beyond what is in the source. It should be possible for any reader without specialist knowledge to understand the deductions." This is what I mean by appropriate boundaries of speculation. I've given my reasoning here, and from that alone you can come to the logical conclusion that Habba Kee could very well be related to Neva Kee, or that, given much of Habba Kee's ambiguous canonicity, they could have been intended to be the same person. Now, from canon policy it clearly states "Except in cases of vandalism, obscenity, and other nonsense, you should not edit the article and simply delete the text" and in Vandalism it very, very clearly states that simply deleting portions of an article constitutes vandalism.98.27.213.72 03:36, May 1, 2012 (UTC)
