Talk: Battle of Mandalore/Legends

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Duel at Sundari

I've been trying to do a separate article on Darth Sidious' duel with Darth Maul and Savage Opress here, but Cade Calrayn and JangFett keep trying to take it down and redirect it here. However, since the Duel on Yavin 4 and Duel on Death Star II both have separate pages (and similarly with other duels) despite being covered in their respective battles (Battle of Muunilinst and Battle of Endor respectively), I felt it appropriate to separate the duel at Sundari from the battle of Sundari. What do you all think? Milar Kayne (talk) 15:38, March 15, 2013 (UTC)

  • In general, a single, concentrated event should deserve a single article. There are exceptions depending on notability, but if a duel is part of a larger conflict, then making a separate article for the duel would be repetitive when the information can be detailed in the larger battle article. Examples include the Battle of Christophsis (see the various redirects), the Battle of the Kaliida Nebula (see Mission aboard the Malevolence), the Battle of Coruscant (see Duel on the Invisible Hand), and also Duel on Geonosis and Duel on Naboo. Again, there are exceptions depending on notability, but that is the general rule. Because the duel in the palace is not directly related to the overall battle in Sundari, it could potentially be a separate article, but I would personally say that it should be in the "Battle of Sundari" article to keep everything simpler. If the duel is a separate article,t he information would have to be covered in two articles instead of one, which is the kind of repetition that we try to avoid for articles on battles. CC7567 (talk) 20:00, March 15, 2013 (UTC)
    • If this is the general consensus (which I am not convinced of yet), would it be permissible for me to expand the coverage of the duel as given in the Battle of Sundari article? If not, I would prefer to keep the duel in a separate article. Thanks, Milar Kayne (talk) 20:46, March 15, 2013 (UTC)
      • What exactly isn't covered in the Battle of Sundari article? I'm not seeing anything different between the two, other than the fact that you go very play-by-play and are writing entirely in present tense. Cade Calrayn GalacticRepublicEmblem-Traced-TORkit 20:57, March 15, 2013 (UTC)
        • I'm going to have to agree with CC here. I myself have merged several articles into one, because they are similar in time and objectives, and indeed are less-than-separate. I believe those characteristics apply to the Duel at Sundari article. Corellian PremierJedi symbolThe Force will be with you always 19:07, March 16, 2013 (UTC)
        • I think the duel should be a separate article because I feel like the duel and the rest of the battle were unconnected. They were concurrent, and in the same city, but the combatants in the main battle were not even aware of the duel, nor were the duelists aware of the larger battle. In the examples given above, the concentrated events were fought by combatants that participated in the larger battle, and the concentrated events helped accomplished the goals of the larger battles. In this case Palpatine was trying to eliminate his rivals, while Bo-Katan's forces were trying to get Obi-Wan off the planet/free Mandalore. This seems like two separate events to me. Also, why would the duel need to be covered in Battle of Sundari, except for perhaps a brief mention? Tomari7 (talk) 02:38, March 17, 2013 (UTC)
        • I agree. Maul and Savage may have been the targets of the rebels, but Sidious was not involved in the rest of the battle. Had Maul and Savage not been essentially rogue Sith, the duel probably would not have occurred. Had it been something that followed logically from the battle (say, for example, if Kenobi had dueled the two Sith), I would agree with merging the two articles. Thanks for the clarification, Tomari! Milar Kayne (talk) 04:34, March 17, 2013 (UTC)
          • Another reason that this situation is different from the merged examples above is that, unlike the merged events, the duel could have occured exactly in the same manner without the battle, and the battle could have occured in the same way without the duel. It is just coincedence that they were concurrent, a coincedence ultimately driven by the need to fit many events into a 22 minute episode. Tomari7 (talk) 04:55, March 22, 2013 (UTC)
          • If anything, I would suggest that the coverage of the duel in the battle's article should be reduced to little more than minimal synopsis, as opposed to the current description. Also, for those arguing over the presence of "trivia" in the "Behind the Scenes" section of the Duel at Sundari page, please note that in many Wookieepedia articles that are accepted as well-developed much of what is listed is nothing more than trivia. If you prefer to be strict about suppressing trivia (in violation of the trivia code of conduct), then be fair and remove the "Behind the Scenes" section from every article on Wookieepedia. Cheers, Milar Kayne (talk) 05:40, March 22, 2013 (UTC)

Delete Duel info?

Now that Duel at Sundari looks like it's going to be staying around, any objections to removing the parts about it in this article? Tomari7 (talk) 00:19, April 14, 2013 (UTC)

No objections at all! In fact, as I think I said before, I'd strongly suggest reducing it to just passing mention. I'd say don't delete it completely; just mention it and link. Cheers, Milar Kayne (talk) 02:40, April 14, 2013 (UTC)
Actually it should probably be shifted to the aftermath and cut down some. Corellian PremierJedi symbolThe Force will be with you always 02:43, April 14, 2013 (UTC)

It appears that my edit to remove the information on the duel was undone. I don't see any reason to keep it in the article, now that it has been decided that the duel was not part of the battle, but does anyone want to give a reason to keep it before I remove it again? Tomari7 (talk) 00:48, April 15, 2013 (UTC)

  • You should probably wait more than two and a half hours before simply removing it, and give people time to respond. Also, maybe it should be put in the aftermath section like Corellian Premier said? Trip391 (talk) 01:26, April 15, 2013 (UTC)
    • The first time, I did, and I did. (Note that I first asked for objections yesterday) I also covered it in the aftermath section, but I cut it down to 4 or 5 sentences because I felt that extensive coverage was unnecessary. If people think it should be covered more than that, that'd be another thing worth bringing up. Tomari7 (talk) 01:38, April 15, 2013 (UTC)
  • Yea, sorry, I didn't look at the day, just the time. But definitely wait a little bit longer, some people don't come on every day. Trip391 (talk) 01:55, April 15, 2013 (UTC)
  • I restored the information on the duel because, while it is indeed a separate conflict related to the Sith instead of the Death Watch power struggle, it's also taking place within the sphere of the larger battle, and each occurs as they do at the same time because of the same catalyst: Maul. Trimmed as it has been, down to a mere two paragraphs and a single image, I feel as though the succinct section still has a place in the overall battle article, and provides a transitional link to the specific article on the duel itself for the interested. Bella'Mia (talk) 03:36, April 15, 2013 (UTC)

Who won the Battle

I was wondering who really won the battle, Nite Owls or Super Commandos, or if it is unknown--50.107.45.106 23:19, May 13, 2013 (UTC)Jedi Wookiee

Battle order

It's amusing that after the whole argument over whether Cato Neimoidia and the bombing actually did come next, it is now confirmed they did. Who would have thought... Milar Kayne (talk) 01:47, October 13, 2013 (UTC)