This page is an archive of a community-wide discussion. This page is no longer live. Further comments or questions on this topic should be made in a new Senate Hall page rather than here so that this page is preserved as a historic record. Graestan(Talk) 23:22, June 18, 2010 (UTC)
Now I've checked out the Star Wars website and see why the metric system is used on articles about characters. But I do not think this is fair to feature the metric system alone for height, not everyone uses the metric system in the real world. We are a separate entity from LucusFilm so I do not see why we have to follow them to the letter in this aspect. It's not fair for those like that don't use the metric system. I suggest we add a template like the one on Wikipedia that shows the height in both metric in American units for fairness to the readers like myself who do not use nor understand the metric system.--Christianrocker90 (talk) 23:19, March 19, 2010 (UTC)
- Though I can sympathize with your frustration, I seriously doubt this community will ever agree to your suggestion. We are not Wikipedia and the MOS says we use the metric system for consistency with sources of canon. Since our subject articles are written in-universe we use the metric system because the GFFA does not use the imperial system. Sorry, you're just going to have to live with it. - Esjs(Talk) 03:51, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I simply don't understand, it's the same in both by physical size in both so why not for the people those don't understand or simply don't use the metric system? I understand your problem but that doesn't solve my problem it actually avoids a problem. Something has to be done cause when I'm reading about say Luke Skywalker I don't want to have google open in another tab converting sizes for me. It harms nothing to have a convert template to convert for the real world. Even in-universe some exceptions must be made for the benefit of the reader.--Christianrocker90 (talk) 07:14, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
This is same thing as having all pages written in english- there is own wikis for other languages -so if you cannot understand metric system do your own inch-wiki for sw then... I personally like using english (not my mother tongue) and metric system- this is not america's own wiki -using english is enough "american" for Star Wars- so since it is main language in movies that's ok- metric system is main system in movies so that's ok too... if someone don't understand heights in metric system then you must learn the system -same thing with languages- but metric system is easier to learn -since i understand american systems fairy easily--Swashbuckler1138 08:21, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Plus, it's far simpler to just stick with one system than cause confusion and inconsistency by having two systems. Metric is the one used in-universe so that is the one we use. Nayayen—TALK 09:36, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Everything you all said goes back to my comment "Even in-universe some exceptions must be made for the benefit of the reader." I know that's what's used in-universe and the wiki is written as such, but what about those in the real word? It doesn't hurt you, this wiki or anything to have a template that automatically converts the metric to American and displays it in parenthesis. The comments by Swashbuckler strike me as European-centric (I didn't want to say Europe but it's all I could think of for the term I wanted). And people have a lot more important things to do than to learn a new measurement system for a wiki. Judging by your comments, it seems you do not care about the readers, only yourself, Swashbuckler. As I see it, if you truly care about the readers, you must cater to readers from all countries not just those that use the metric system. And please don't throw me response of "But our MOS says this." cause that's the purpose of discussion to improve things like the MOS. Now, are we gonna improve this for all our readers or just those that use the metric system?--Christianrocker90 (talk) 11:29, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- The thing is, there is a difference between the American system that you are suggesting be added and the equivalent Imperial system that is (or rather, was) used in Europe (or at least the UK). For example, a US ton is 907kg/2000lb whereas an Imperial ton is 1016kg/2440lb whereas the (metric) tonne is simply 1000kg. Having three different versions to satisfy some readers who do not know of or want to use a site such as WolframAlpha or a Google search for "350kg to lbs" (try it) is getting out of hand. There is no reason to add an exception for the three countries (USA, Burma and Liberia) that have not adopted the SI units: metric. If you still feel that there is a need for it, then by all means start a vote on the Consensus track. Nayayen—TALK 12:59, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Everything you all said goes back to my comment "Even in-universe some exceptions must be made for the benefit of the reader." I know that's what's used in-universe and the wiki is written as such, but what about those in the real word? It doesn't hurt you, this wiki or anything to have a template that automatically converts the metric to American and displays it in parenthesis. The comments by Swashbuckler strike me as European-centric (I didn't want to say Europe but it's all I could think of for the term I wanted). And people have a lot more important things to do than to learn a new measurement system for a wiki. Judging by your comments, it seems you do not care about the readers, only yourself, Swashbuckler. As I see it, if you truly care about the readers, you must cater to readers from all countries not just those that use the metric system. And please don't throw me response of "But our MOS says this." cause that's the purpose of discussion to improve things like the MOS. Now, are we gonna improve this for all our readers or just those that use the metric system?--Christianrocker90 (talk) 11:29, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I would like to add, in regard to this wiki being in-universe, that while the inch, foot, yard, and mile all canonically exist, there is no canonical evidence whatsoever that the conversion factors between those units and metric units (or for that matter, conversion factors just between those units) are the same in the Star Wars universe as they are in the real world. Therefore, conversions based on real-world conversion factors would violate Wookieepedia:Canon policy#What is not considered a valid resource?, which specifies that "[c]onjecture based our own universe" is not allowed. —Master Jonathan(Jedi Council Chambers) 01:44, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- Then your policies are broken and only care for those that are absolutely bonkers over star wars. You policies should be of that to benefit the wiki and the reader likewise. It makes it hard to trust a wiki that doesn't sacrifice it's policies for the benefit of the reader which in the end is who matters. I think the Wikipedia policy WP:IAR would apply nicely here for the benefit of the wiki and the reader alike.--Christianrocker90 (talk) 07:48, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- There are two choices with regards to the policy: leave it as is and have a few people have to convert it themselves (it really isn't that difficult to type the number into WolframAlpha; it converts it to dozens of systems) until they work out the metric system (you don't even have to have it exact; 1 meter is about 3 foot etc) or we convert it in the articles and violate the policy that Jonathan linked above and then provide an inaccurate source for readers. The former sounds like it is much easier to do; it doesn't mean that all the measurements need to have a (possibly) inaccurate conversion added to them. Nayayen—TALK 10:13, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- Then your policies are broken and only care for those that are absolutely bonkers over star wars. You policies should be of that to benefit the wiki and the reader likewise. It makes it hard to trust a wiki that doesn't sacrifice it's policies for the benefit of the reader which in the end is who matters. I think the Wikipedia policy WP:IAR would apply nicely here for the benefit of the wiki and the reader alike.--Christianrocker90 (talk) 07:48, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- There's the option of just learning the metric system. That's what I did. Less hassle and you broaden your horizons as well. Trak Nar Ramble on 07:56, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- Considering anyone who wants to be regarded as a remotely competent individual in this world needs to at least have some grasp of it, that's not such a bad idea. There's a reason it gets taught in schools, after all. Just because Wikipedia feels the need to cater to my fellow Americans' parochial measurement system doesn't mean we need follow suit. jSarek 08:06, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- There's the option of just learning the metric system. That's what I did. Less hassle and you broaden your horizons as well. Trak Nar Ramble on 07:56, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- I'm begging you to quit with this anti-American talk when it comes to our measurement system. Second, it wasn't taught in my schools. Lastly, like I've already said I have more important thing than to learn a measurement system I'm only gonna pay attention to on this wiki.--Christianrocker90 (talk) 08:10, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- First off (and this is coming from an American), the metric system is way better. I really wish we would convert. Secondly, I don't see why the rest of the world should cater to three countries, especially when two of them are rather small (no offense to any Burmese or Liberians). Third, I don't see what the big deal is with A. ignoring the metric measurements, B. Googling the conversions, or C. getting a basic understanding of the metric system. DarthDragon164
Dragon's Lair 17:05, March 21, 2010 (UTC)
- As a Canadian, who grew up with the metric system, I'm finding it particularly easy :) But it all seriousness, it would be just as difficult for fans from outside the US to convert to the Imperial system, just because Star Wars is an American invention. It's bigger than that now. Bigger than all of us. So I'm in favor of keeping everything metric, which has been used by official sources anyways. Remember too that the metric system is SI. Système International. It appeals to all, because it is international and universal. And it's easy to learn; it's not about converting numbers, it's about making new baselines. OBSERVE: http://www.xkcd.com/526/. Taral, Dark Lord of the Sith -Just shy, not antisocial: You can talk to me!- 12:47, March 22, 2010 (UTC)
This is interesting how personally you strike against me Christianrocker90 - i just added that i had to learn english to understand this wiki so why cannot you learn the metric system- i seriously think you can- it won't take long- it is used in most countries and easy to learn (same as english as language)- one foot is 30 centimeters and 100 centimeters is one meter- very easy -i can convert inches and all to meters and so on- pretty quickly so i don't understand why you cannot do the same thing -other way around... And why these sizes in wookieepedia are even important i don't get it- most of sizes are inaccurate anyway... --Swashbuckler1138 17:55, March 23, 2010 (UTC) Also you Christianrocker90- It is you who seem to care only about yourself and other americans- I agree that it would be fair if there would be both units here- but it is very difficult to do because of all these already said reasons- I just said that it is similar to languages- it is similarly unfair that all information is not translated to every language on Earth- there is wikis for other languages- but not many are as good as this- and if you're "too busy" (who is selfcentered?)to learn new measurement system how you have time to leave so many comments here i don't get it--Swashbuckler1138 18:10, March 23, 2010 (UTC)
- Drop it. I'm serious. This topic is over; the CT is going to fail, and there's no sense continuing a rapidly-degenerating discussion. Chack Jadson (Talk) 23:59, March 23, 2010 (UTC)