[09:59:17] <Tommy-Macaroni> So, welcome, one and all, to our 32nd Mofference.
[09:59:25] <Tommy-Macaroni> First up, we have Tope discussing the mysterious AbuseFilter. The floor is yours.
[09:59:30] <Toprawa> Thank you
[09:59:36] * CorellianPremier (4395d43f@wookieepedia/CorellianPremier) has joined
[09:59:37] * ChanServ gives voice to CorellianPremier
[09:59:37] * Nuku-Nuku gives voice to CorellianPremier
[09:59:45] <Toprawa> For those of you unaware, the AbuseFilter is an automated edit prevention tool
[09:59:45] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from CorellianPremier
[09:59:55] <Toprawa> It's designed and run by people outside Wookieepedia
[09:59:58] <Toprawa> We use it through MediaWiki
[10:00:22] <Toprawa> Sorry, just finding the link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki
[10:00:23] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: MediaWiki - Wikipedia (at en.wikipedia.org)
[10:00:42] <Toprawa> In extreme cases, it allows us to auto-block people that we know will be adding certain text to articles
[10:01:00] <Toprawa> Like "cock" and "fuck" to use some frank examples
[10:01:27] <Toprawa> Unfortunately, Wikia's volunteer spam task force has trouble learning that we don't want them interfering with our local business
[10:02:01] <Toprawa> Our Blocking policy specifically forbids VSTF from issuing local blocks https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ABlocking_policy
[10:02:02] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Blocking policy | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:02:24] <Toprawa> And we've recently learned that VSTF also likes to stick their noses into our AbuseFilters, which is annoying
[10:02:40] <Toprawa> So I am proposing a rule for how AbuseFilter blocks may be handled
[10:03:10] <Toprawa> Good ol' Zev Senesca brings you the proposal: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca
[10:03:11] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:03:24] <Toprawa> Please compare to https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ABlocking_policy
[10:03:26] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Blocking policy | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:03:31] * Lewisrr has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[10:03:32] <Toprawa> The bold portion in the proposal is the new text
[10:03:34] <Toprawa> Tommy
[10:03:40] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:03:48] <Toprawa> Please discuss
[10:03:55] * Lewisr (~Lewisr@wookieepedia/Lewisr) has joined
[10:03:55] * ChanServ gives voice to Lewisr
[10:03:59] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from Lewisr
[10:04:13] <Tommy-Macaroni> I've had a look through already, and the proposal is great
[10:04:29] <Ayrehead> Yeah, no objections from me
[10:04:39] <MasterFred> I'd much rather full blocking control be under local administration.
[10:04:44] <Tommy-Macaroni> VSTF do like a work around our policies, and it's good to make it clear that blocks may only be issued by elected admins
[10:04:44] <DarthRuiz30> ^same
[10:04:47] <ecks> just to clarify, AbuseFilter is a MediaWiki extension that the admins control, the MW developers don't have any say in that
[10:04:47] <MasterFred> So I have no complaints.
[10:04:49] <Toprawa> I should also clarify that the Blocking policy doesn't currently stipulate AbuseFilter use, so this is accomplishing that while also specifying that VSTF butt out
[10:05:28] <Imperators> looks good
[10:05:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yeah, it's nice to give more people info on it, considering much of the tool is hidden for non-sysops
[10:05:48] <AnilSerifoglu> ^
[10:05:48] <Culator|Away> Seriously, I wouldn't have minded if VSTF *suggested* a new filter, but to just go ahead and implement one unilaterally was going too far.
[10:06:06] <Tommy-Macaroni> Agreed
[10:06:36] <spookly> It's important for a wiki to retain autonomy within their community, and not have people who weren't voted in by their editors doing things in the blocking arena. So, agreed
[10:06:56] <Tommy-Macaroni> That should be ample time to read it, so if we're all in agreement, I'll start the vote imminently
[10:07:07] <Tommy-Macaroni> If anyone else has any comments, please speak
[10:07:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK
[10:07:24] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Blocking policy with information on the Abuse Filter:
[10:07:27] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:07:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:07:29] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:07:29] <Imperators> ~support
[10:07:29] <miki> ~support
[10:07:30] <Fan26> ~support
[10:07:31] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:07:31] <RattsT> ~support
[10:07:31] <spookly> ~support
[10:07:32] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:07:32] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:07:33] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:07:33] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:07:33] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:07:33] <Zed42> ~support
[10:07:34] <Culator|Away> ~support
[10:07:36] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:07:38] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:07:58] <ecks> ~support
[10:08:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote closing in 10 seconds
[10:08:18] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:08:49] * PurpleTentacle (~bot@wookieepedia/administrator/GreenTentacle) has joined
[10:08:49] * ChanServ gives channel operator status to PurpleTentacle
[10:08:49] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Blocking policy with information on the Abuse Filter passes 18-0
[10:08:49] * Nuku-Nuku gives channel operator status to PurpleTentacle
[10:08:57] <Tommy-Macaroni> He's here!
[10:09:00] <Toprawa> HERE HE COMES TO SAVE THE DAYYYYYYY
[10:09:09] <Tommy-Macaroni> Thank God, I can't count for shit
[10:09:19] <Toprawa> Testing:
[10:09:24] <Toprawa> ~open
[10:09:24] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Voting is open.
[10:09:25] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:09:25] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:09:27] <Toprawa> ~close
[10:09:27] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Voting is closed.
[10:09:27] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support: 1
[10:09:28] <Toprawa> ~tally
[10:09:28] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: 'Support': 1
[10:09:29] <Toprawa> YUSSSS
[10:09:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> Fuck yes
[10:09:34] <Toprawa> Ok, just follow that same procedure
[10:09:44] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:09:52] <Tommy-Macaroni> Cool
[10:09:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> Next up, Tope’s at it again with audiobooks. Speaking of, I’d like to thank today’s sponsor, audib-
[10:09:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> I joke. The floor’s all yours.
[10:09:56] <Toprawa> Ok
[10:10:01] <Toprawa> This one is kind of a two-parter
[10:10:05] <Toprawa> It affects two different policy pages
[10:10:16] <Toprawa> But I'm going to propose it all in one go, since it doesn't make sense to approve one without the other, really
[10:10:20] <Toprawa> Audiobooks
[10:10:22] * Culator|Away is now known as Darth_Culator
[10:10:34] <Toprawa> I'm proposing a method for how to name our audiobooks, since we have many different versions of these things from different publishers
[10:10:40] <Toprawa> The Heir to the Empire audiobook has like four of them
[10:11:23] <Toprawa> This is the first part (it doesn't actually matter which is first or second)
[10:11:24] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca
[10:11:25] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:11:43] <Toprawa> This will be an amendment to the Layout Guide, stipulating how to list audiobooks in Appearances lists
[10:11:53] <Toprawa> Pretty straightforward, so I'll give you a moment to read through that
[10:12:33] <Toprawa> And this is the second part https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca#Naming_policy
[10:12:33] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:12:43] <Toprawa> It stipulates how to name these many audiobook versions
[10:12:51] <Toprawa> And there are also some other little goodies slipped in there that I noticed while working on this :P
[10:12:59] <Toprawa> Namely how to title novel series, etc.
[10:13:04] <Toprawa> Nothing big that we aren't already doing
[10:13:08] <Toprawa> All new changes are in bold
[10:13:17] <Toprawa> Please take a moment to read through
[10:13:42] <Toprawa> Here's the current LG section FWIW https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ALayout_Guide#Appearances
[10:13:43] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:13:49] <Toprawa> This will create a new subsection for Audiobooks
[10:14:01] <Toprawa> And the current Naming policy https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ANaming_policy#Real-world_publications
[10:14:02] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Naming policy | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:14:23] <Toprawa> Specifically, this current paragraph is being reworked into the rest of that section: "To disambiguate, add the type of literary work in parentheses, such as "(novel)," "(comic)," or "(short story)." Articles may use "(book)" to disambiguate a non-fiction book. For novelizations, such as film novelizations or junior film novelizations, use either "(novelization)" or "(junior novelization)" as appropriate.
[10:14:23] <Toprawa> "
[10:14:37] <Toprawa> Please feel free to keep reading as now open the floow
[10:14:40] <Toprawa> floor*
[10:14:46] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:15:01] <Imperators> nice work
[10:15:16] <MasterFred> Thank goodness for some parenthetical consistency.
[10:15:26] <Fan26> Seems pretty reasonable
[10:15:28] <spookly> ^
[10:15:30] <DarthRuiz30> ^
[10:15:30] <AnilSerifoglu> Pretty clear-cut
[10:15:33] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yeah, this specificity is needed, and the other tidbits are nice to have too, such as the parenthetical consistency as Fred says
[10:15:33] <CorellianPremier> Looks good
[10:15:45] <RattsT> One thing: currently audiobooks are pipelinked in Appearances sections to not include the parenthesis. Is this affected by the proposal?
[10:16:06] <Toprawa> This is covered in the proposal
[10:16:14] <Toprawa> That's actually the whole point of this proposal :P
[10:16:15] <Toprawa> How to format that
[10:16:22] <Cwedin> Would this cover things like [[Canto Bight (novella collection)]]?
[10:16:27] <Toprawa> I can't explain it any better than just how it's presented
[10:16:39] <Shayanomer> I assume a bot is ready to fix all those instances once this passes
[10:16:45] <Toprawa> I can't explain it any better than just how it's presented
[10:17:04] <Toprawa> Cwedin: Anything that isn't specifically covered falls under this: To disambiguate for any publication type not covered in the following sections, use the type of literary work, such as "(short story)" (example: The Tale of the Aiwha Pod (short story))
[10:17:14] <Tommy-Macaroni> I can look into coding something once this is passed
[10:17:19] <Cwedin> Got it
[10:17:28] <Zed42> Those current audiobook disambiguators are pretty messy, so having a policy for it is a good idea
[10:17:39] <Darth_Culator> I hate audiobooks. I hate audiobooks so very, very much. But this seems reasonable enough.
[10:17:50] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, starting vote imminently, please say anything you have to say folks
[10:17:58] <Toprawa> RattsT: Specifically, your question falls under the first part of this proposal, the Appearances Layout Guide amendment
[10:18:02] <Toprawa> That's why this is all one proposal
[10:18:04] <Toprawa> They work together
[10:18:15] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca#Audiobooks
[10:18:16] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:18:41] <Toprawa> In like 99% of cases, there will be 2 or more audiobooks listed
[10:18:47] <Toprawa> So the parentheses will be included most of the time
[10:18:49] <RattsT> Right, so App sections will continue to not use paranthesis
[10:19:02] <Toprawa> No, they will
[10:19:04] <Toprawa> Read :P
[10:19:15] <Toprawa> Exactly how those items are presented is how the Appearances list will look
[10:19:38] <RattsT> Sorry, I meant how "The New Jedi Order: Vector Prime audiobook" doesn't use them
[10:19:40] <Toprawa> Like I said, I can't explain this any better than it's presented
[10:19:50] <Tommy-Macaroni> This is clearly explained in the proposed policy, so I'm going ahead and starting the vote
[10:19:52] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Appearances and Wookieepedia:Naming Policy#Real-world publications with information on audiobooks (and more):
[10:19:56] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:19:56] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:19:56] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:19:56] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:19:57] <miki> ~support
[10:19:57] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:19:58] <Imperators> ~support
[10:19:58] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:19:58] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:19:58] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:19:59] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:19:59] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:20:00] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:20:00] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:20:00] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:20:00] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:20:01] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:20:01] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:20:02] <Fan26> ~support
[10:20:02] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:20:03] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:20:03] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:20:06] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:20:06] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:20:07] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:20:07] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:20:09] <RattsT> ~support
[10:20:09] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:20:16] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:20:16] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:20:18] <ecks> ~support
[10:20:18] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:20:19] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:20:19] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:20:22] <Zed42> ~support
[10:20:23] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:20:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:20:43] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:20:43] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:20:44] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 17
[10:20:47] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:20:54] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Appearances and Wookieepedia:Naming Policy#Real-world publications with information on audiobooks (and more) passes 17-0
[10:21:03] <Tommy-Macaroni> I’m up next. Eesh. Guess the floor’s all mine.
[10:21:13] <Tommy-Macaroni> Today I wanna discuss Wookieepedia:Layout Guide’s section on the Eras template.
[10:21:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> Simply, I would like to replace https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Layout_Guide#Eras_tag
[10:21:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> With
[10:21:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User:Tommy-Macaroni/Other
[10:21:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> (Ignore the Star Destroyer stuff)
[10:21:33] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:21:34] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User:Tommy-Macaroni/Other | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:21:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> The current Eras policy is woefully incomplete, with it not mentioning GAs or CAs; oddly specifying when to use "real," despite that only being for OOU articles; and ultimately passes off providing additional information onto Template:Eras itself.
[10:21:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> My new version fully explains and lists all possible parameters relevant to an IU article, and explains when to use them and which order they should be in.
[10:22:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> *passing
[10:22:29] <Tommy-Macaroni> Most of this stuff is policy already, although I have added some specifics I’d like to draw attention to. First, "If the formatted title contains the entirety of the original title, {{PAGENAME}} should be used in lieu of typing out the title. For example, Executrix should use "title=''{{PAGENAME}}''," not "title=''Executrix''." This has been kinda up to the editor’s discretion until now, and for some
[10:22:29] <Tommy-Macaroni> reason typing the name out had been favoured on IU articles, while {{PAGENAME}} is used more often on OOU pages. Technically speaking, {{PAGENAME}} is superior, so I think it’s time we make this usage consistent and mandatory.
[10:22:44] <Tommy-Macaroni> Second, "Use "notoc=1" in Eras to remove an unwanted table of contents. The table of contents should only be removed if an article has no in-universe prose sections (e.g. "History" or "Powers and abilities"). This means articles that have content sections other than "Behind the scenes," such as "History" or "Powers and abilities," should not remove their table of contents, whereas articles whose only prose
[10:22:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> section is "Behind the scenes" should remove their table of contents." Again, notoc usage has been up to the editor’s discretion up until this point, so I think it’s high time we mandate when it’s appropriate to remove it. As a note, this will allow for formal objections on CAs pertaining to notoc, when before using the parameter could only be advised as it was not actual policy.
[10:22:55] <Tommy-Macaroni> And just to clarify, this is only for the IU Layout Guide, hence why parameters like "real" and "uprot" are not mentioned. I’d like to also rewrite the OOU version at some point in the future, but that’s not relevant for today.
[10:23:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> So, thanks to Imperators and Tope for feedback and copy-editing the proposal.
[10:23:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> And that’s all. I open the floor.
[10:23:05] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:23:07] <Imperators> was fortunate enough to have a prior look at this. Good work.
[10:23:25] <MasterFred> Same as Imp. Already looked over it and am satisfied. :D
[10:23:31] <Toprawa> Yuh, ees gud
[10:23:32] <Ayrehead> Same and it all looks shipshape
[10:23:35] <Fan26> Good to have clearer policy on this, I've been confused on this more than once
[10:23:42] <spookly> For sure
[10:23:45] <Zed42> Looks good
[10:23:53] <Shayanomer> Nice work
[10:24:05] <Imperators> it is a quite complex template so it's good to have this as detailed as possible
[10:24:06] <DarthRuiz30> good work
[10:24:07] <MasterFred> Yeah, we should always attempt to make things as clear for new editors as possible, and this goes toward that goal.
[10:24:26] <Toprawa> Getting them to read is the hard part :P
[10:24:45] <CorellianPremier> Yes, this is much superior.
[10:24:49] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yeah. Once this and the OOU one are done I'll probably update the instructions on the template itself, but future Tommy can worry about that
[10:25:05] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, we all seem to be in agreement. Starting vote in a moment
[10:25:18] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Eras tag:
[10:25:18] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:25:18] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:25:18] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:25:19] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:25:21] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:25:21] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:25:21] <miki> ~support
[10:25:22] <RattsT> ~support
[10:25:22] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:25:22] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:25:22] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:25:22] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:25:22] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[10:25:22] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:25:22] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:25:22] <Imperators> ~support
[10:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[10:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:25:23] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:25:24] <Fan26> ~support
[10:25:24] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:25:24] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:25:24] <Zed42> ~support
[10:25:24] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:25:26] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:25:27] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:25:27] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:25:28] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:25:31] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:25:31] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:25:35] <ecks> ~support
[10:25:36] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:25:37] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:25:37] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:25:39] <spookly> ~support
[10:25:39] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[10:25:47] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:25:47] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:25:54] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:26:11] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:26:11] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:26:12] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 19
[10:26:14] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:26:21] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Eras tag passes 19-0
[10:26:25] * Tommy-Macaroni gives voice to miki
[10:26:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, miki is up next, discussing Vote ratios in consensus forums. The floor is yours.
[10:27:00] <miki> so, my proposal is about modifying vote ratios specified in WP:CON
[10:27:02] <miki> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Consensus#Rules
[10:27:04] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Consensus | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:27:39] <miki> I'd like you to take a look at the following table:
[10:27:41] <miki> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Administrators%27_how-to_guide#Closing_consensus_votes
[10:27:42] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Administrators' how-to guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:28:38] <miki> as you can see, there's a slight anomaly, where 17-7 is a no consensus outcome, but an additional *oppose* vote turns it into *support*
[10:28:49] <miki> (and same vice versa)
[10:29:05] <miki> therefore, I propose following new limits:
[10:29:10] <miki> Forums with 17-22 votes require a 5:2 ratio
[10:29:13] <miki> Forums with 23 or more votes require a 2:1 ratio
[10:29:25] <miki> this will result in following outcomes:
[10:29:30] <miki> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:01miki10/sandbox
[10:29:31] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:01miki10/sandbox | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:30:16] <miki> that's it, now discussion
[10:30:17] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:30:30] <Toprawa> Just for clarification, listing the old and revised ratios:
[10:30:35] <Toprawa> Current ratios:
[10:30:36] <Toprawa> Forums with 10-16 votes require a 3:1 ratio
[10:30:36] <Toprawa> Forums with 17-24 votes require a 5:2 ratio
[10:30:36] <Toprawa> Forums with 25 or more votes may pass with a 2:1 ratio
[10:30:44] <Toprawa> New ratios:
[10:30:51] <Toprawa> Forums with 17-22 votes require a 5:2 ratio Forums with 23 or more votes require a 2:1 ratio
[10:31:06] <Ayrehead> Makes sense to me
[10:31:15] <Imperators> yeah, that outlier was weird
[10:31:17] <ecks> I'm for getting rid of the anomaly, but in this new system, 16-8 will pass
[10:31:21] <ecks> not sure if that's too lenient
[10:31:26] <Toprawa> The current ratios are set up purely because they look nice, like 25 was a nice round number
[10:31:38] <Toprawa> But the actual numbers don't work out quite perfectly, as indicated
[10:32:13] <Tommy-Macaroni> Seems logical to me
[10:32:18] <ecks> but I'm not too worried about it anyway
[10:32:18] <AnilSerifoglu> ^
[10:32:30] <Toprawa> I'm open to further revisions if you have any suggestions, ecks
[10:32:35] <Darth_Culator> Later, perhaps we can revisit those ratios in greater depth. For now, this is a logical adjustment.
[10:32:39] <Toprawa> I agree with the 16/8 issue
[10:33:02] <ecks> not sure if I can come up with anything better on the spot tbh
[10:33:15] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yeah, I think this is good for now
[10:33:25] <Tommy-Macaroni> But it should probably be addressed at some point
[10:33:26] <miki> first I considered only changing the limit from 25 to 24, but that only moved the anomaly by one place
[10:33:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, please speak if you have anything to add
[10:33:47] * Defender1031 (~DeFender1@109-186-131-241.bb.netvision.net.il) has joined
[10:34:05] <MasterFred> I think this is a good solution until we can figure out how to make it work with the 16:8 situation.
[10:34:10] <spookly> ^
[10:34:11] <ecks> although I will miss that little anomaly
[10:34:12] <MasterFred> We can take any updates to the TC.
[10:34:12] <Tommy-Macaroni> Agreed
[10:34:16] <ecks> it is top 5 Wook bar trivia
[10:34:18] <MasterFred> *CT
[10:34:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to modify the vote totals on Wookieepedia:Consensus#Rules:
[10:34:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:34:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:34:28] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:34:28] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:34:32] <miki> ~support
[10:34:32] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:34:33] <Imperators> ~support
[10:34:33] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:34:33] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:34:34] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:34:34] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:34:34] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:34:34] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:34:34] <Zed42> ~support
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[10:34:36] <RattsT> ~support
[10:34:36] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:34:36] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:34:37] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:34:37] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:34:38] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:34:39] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:34:40] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:34:44] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:34:45] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:34:47] <ecks> ~support
[10:34:48] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:34:49] <Fan26> ~support
[10:34:49] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:35:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:35:08] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:35:09] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:35:19] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:35:19] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:35:19] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 18
[10:35:27] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:35:30] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to modify the vote totals on Wookieepedia:Consensus#Rules passes 18-0
[10:35:33] <Tommy-Macaroni> Next up, Miki’s back at it again, this time discussing the editing of comments containing personal attacks. Go for it.
[10:35:45] <miki> this will affect WP:TALK
[10:36:11] <miki> currently, comments only containing personal attacks can be deleted, which is obvious
[10:36:37] <miki> however, comments having both personal attacks and relevant discussion may neither be removed nor edited
[10:37:29] <miki> I'm proposing that in the latter case, we allow editing the comment to remove a personal attack, but leave the rest of it intact
[10:37:55] <miki> point 2 would be (emphasis mine):
[10:38:01] <miki> No user may edit another user's comment, except *to remove a personal attack* or to redact private personal information prior to requesting RevisionDeletion by a bureaucrat or Fandom Staff member.
[10:38:18] <miki> second point of point 6 would becom
[10:38:21] <miki> become*
[10:38:34] <miki> Comments that contain personal attacks as well as discussion relevant to the matter at hand, even if the relevant discussion is presented in an uncivil manner. Others may find the actual discussion portion of the comment helpful. Instead of removing the *entire comment, only the personal attack should be removed.* Offenders should be warned and blocked if needed.
[10:39:29] <miki> time for discussion now
[10:39:32] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:39:32] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from miki
[10:39:51] <Toprawa> Can I suggest just changing "should be removed" to "may be removed"?
[10:40:08] <miki> yeah, that's actually better
[10:40:12] <Toprawa> Sometimes I like keeping the personal attack on my stuff just to highlight someone's idiocy
[10:40:17] <Darth_Culator> ^
[10:40:30] <ecks> sounds good
[10:40:36] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yeah, I like
[10:40:37] <Ayrehead> Yeah this is logical
[10:40:42] <spookly> ^
[10:40:46] <MasterFred> Mmmmm yes
[10:40:50] <Lewisr> No arguments here
[10:40:56] <Fan26> ^
[10:41:25] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, we all seem in agreement
[10:41:35] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote starting in one moment
[10:42:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Talk page policy in regard to personal attacks:
[10:42:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:42:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:42:01] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:42:01] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:42:02] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:42:02] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:42:02] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:42:03] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:42:03] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:42:03] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:42:03] <Zed42> ~support
[10:42:03] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <Fan26> ~support
[10:42:04] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <miki> ~support
[10:42:04] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:42:04] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:42:04] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:42:04] <RattsT> ~support
[10:42:05] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:42:05] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:42:07] <spookly> ~support
[10:42:07] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[10:42:09] <Imperators> ~support
[10:42:10] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:42:10] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:42:10] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:42:10] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:42:10] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:42:12] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:42:12] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:42:24] <ecks> ~support
[10:42:24] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:42:24] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:42:25] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:42:35] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:42:55] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:42:55] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:42:56] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 18
[10:42:58] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:43:04] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Talk page policy in regard to personal attacks passes 18-0
[10:43:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> Imperators is up next, warning us to be careful with special characters. Sounds serious. The floor is yours.
[10:43:15] <Imperators> right
[10:43:21] <Imperators> ladies and laddies
[10:43:36] <Imperators> behold the measly section of the Naming policy titled "Be careful with special characters"
[10:43:38] <Imperators> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Naming_policy#Be_careful_with_special_characters
[10:43:39] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Naming policy | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:43:46] <Imperators> look at it. It's pathetic.
[10:44:01] <Imperators> it's short, uninformative, and outdated or even plain wrong on instances.
[10:44:26] <Imperators> I propose we replace it entirely with what I hope serves us much better:
[10:44:27] <Imperators> https://ecks.fandom.com/wiki/User:Imperators_II
[10:44:28] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User:Imperators II | Ecks Wiki | Fandom (at ecks.fandom.com)
[10:44:44] <Imperators> please take a moment to read through it
[10:44:52] <Imperators> here's the template that's mentioned:
[10:44:52] <Imperators> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Template:Correct_title
[10:44:53] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Template:Correct title | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:45:02] <Imperators> (it's got some juicy documentation, too)
[10:45:05] <Imperators> that's it, thanks
[10:45:07] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:45:18] <Toprawa> I live for juicy documentation
[10:45:40] <ecks> >mfw no backup links in the documentation
[10:45:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> I've already had a look over this, nice work
[10:45:54] <CorellianPremier> Cool
[10:46:24] <Ayrehead> support for the juicy doc
[10:46:30] <spookly> Looks fine
[10:46:35] <MasterFred> Love me some thicc doc
[10:46:44] <ecks> change the template to read s/restrictions/limitations/ and i'll be happy
[10:46:46] <Imperators> this is rapidly getting off rails :P
[10:46:51] <miki> I think that lowercase titles shouldn't use the template
[10:47:04] <miki> you can change the displayed title, you can link to them using the correct title
[10:47:28] <Imperators> in case of lowercase titles, miki, the template only informs why the url contains an uppercase title
[10:48:03] <miki> okay, but I still think that it's unnecessary
[10:48:18] <Imperators> and technically articles with lowercase titles *exist* at uppercase titles, hence the exact wording of the proposed policy
[10:48:54] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, if we're done
[10:48:56] <Darth_Culator> I'm with ecks on "restrictions" vs "limitations."
[10:49:19] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Naming policy#Be careful with special characters:
[10:49:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:49:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:49:23] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:49:23] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:49:25] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:49:25] <miki> ~support
[10:49:26] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:49:26] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:49:26] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:49:26] <Imperators> ~support
[10:49:26] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:49:27] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:49:27] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:49:27] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:49:28] <RattsT> ~support
[10:49:28] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:49:29] <Zed42> ~support
[10:49:29] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:49:29] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:49:29] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[10:49:29] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:49:29] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[10:49:32] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:49:33] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:49:34] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:49:34] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:49:36] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:49:36] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:49:39] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:49:39] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:49:40] <ecks> ~support
[10:49:41] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:49:43] <spookly> ~support
[10:49:44] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[10:49:44] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:49:44] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:49:51] <Fan26> ~support
[10:49:51] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:50:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:50:05] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:50:06] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:50:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:50:22] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:50:23] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 19
[10:50:25] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:50:30] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Naming policy#Be careful with special characters passes 19-0
[10:50:33] <Tommy-Macaroni> Tope’s back. Big Layout Guide stuff. All yours.
[10:50:39] <Toprawa> It is Big.
[10:50:50] <Toprawa> I direct your attentions to the Layout Guide and OOU Layout Guide:
[10:50:53] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ALayout_Guide
[10:50:55] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:51:00] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Layout_Guide/Out-of-universe
[10:51:01] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide/Out-of-universe | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:51:21] <Toprawa> All of our specific article layouts, such as Characters (link: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ALayout_Guide#Character_articles )
[10:51:22] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:51:28] <Toprawa> Have this awful weasel wording in them from 2007
[10:51:32] <Toprawa> "There are some guidelines for the organization of character articles within Wookieepedia. Though there is some flexibility, the following sections are typical:
[10:51:32] <Toprawa> "
[10:51:43] <Toprawa> These are not "guidelines."
[10:51:56] <Toprawa> They never have been, except in 2007 when no one could ever agree on anything and we fought over every inch of everything ever.
[10:52:09] <Toprawa> These are established layout sections that we follow as law
[10:52:31] <Toprawa> I know some of you were to surprised to find this little loophole in the policy to begin with when we first discussed this
[10:52:47] <Toprawa> I am proposing removing this weasel wording and making them the mandated sections they're meant to be
[10:53:09] <Toprawa> These are the current LG and OOU LG sections that use this wording, and how the wording will now read:
[10:53:10] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca
[10:53:11] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:53:39] <Toprawa> The proposed wording already exists here https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Layout_Guide/Out-of-universe#Real-world_person_articles
[10:53:40] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide/Out-of-universe | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:53:47] <Toprawa> That's all. Tommy.
[10:53:49] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:53:54] <ecks> I've never come across an article where the LG-recommended sections haven't been a good fit
[10:53:58] <Imperators> kill the Layout Guidelines
[10:54:00] <Tommy-Macaroni> ll support. This technically meant reviewers could not object to incorrect section headers, as the LG only suggests them, which is ridiculous. Nice to have this official.
[10:54:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> (And yes, I was surprised when I found this out :P)
[10:54:05] <ecks> so I don't see any reason to not make them the law
[10:54:19] <Tommy-Macaroni> *full
[10:54:23] <RattsT> Absolutely
[10:54:25] <ecks> if you wanna go nuts then use subsections
[10:54:26] <spookly> Anything that makes reviewing easier is nice
[10:54:31] <MasterFred> Yeah, there is no good reason not to mandate the sections be as written in the LG.
[10:54:32] <Zed42> For sure
[10:54:32] <Tommy-Macaroni> ^
[10:54:33] <ecks> I encourage witty subsection naming
[10:54:34] <MasterFred> And per spookly
[10:54:52] <Imperators> per ecks
[10:55:17] <GreenTentacle> We were allowing for cases where they didn't fit at the time, but per ecks.
[10:55:35] <Ayrehead> Full agreement with all points from me
[10:55:40] <ecks> like if you nominate an article where all subsections are puns, I'm going to be all over it
[10:55:48] <GreenTentacle> I think it was actually 2008 weasel wording. :P
[10:55:48] <Tommy-Macaroni> Ok, we all seem to be happy with this
[10:55:58] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide and Wookieepedia:Layout Guide/Out-of-universe with firm wording:
[10:56:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[10:56:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[10:56:01] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[10:56:02] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[10:56:02] <miki> ~support
[10:56:02] <RattsT> ~support
[10:56:02] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[10:56:03] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[10:56:04] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[10:56:04] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[10:56:04] <Imperators> ~support
[10:56:04] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[10:56:05] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[10:56:06] <ecks> ~support
[10:56:06] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[10:56:06] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[10:56:06] <Darth_Culator> ~support
[10:56:07] <Toprawa> ~support
[10:56:07] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[10:56:07] <PurpleTentacle> Darth_Culator: Support vote counted.
[10:56:07] <MasterFred> ~support
[10:56:07] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[10:56:07] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[10:56:07] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[10:56:08] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[10:56:08] <Cwedin> ~support
[10:56:08] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[10:56:08] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[10:56:08] <spookly> ~support
[10:56:09] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[10:56:15] <Lewisr> ~support
[10:56:16] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[10:56:16] <Zed42> ~support
[10:56:17] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[10:56:18] <Ayrehead> ~support
[10:56:18] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[10:56:21] <Shayanomer> ~support
[10:56:21] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[10:56:25] <Fan26> ~support
[10:56:25] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[10:56:27] * Darth_Culator is now known as Culator|Away
[10:56:36] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[10:56:48] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[10:56:48] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[10:56:48] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 19
[10:56:52] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[10:56:58] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide and Wookieepedia:Layout Guide/Out-of-universe with firm wording passes 19-0
[10:57:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> Next up, we have Tope explaining why it’s sometimes best not to link to stuff. Floor is yours.
[10:57:09] <Toprawa> Roight
[10:57:43] <Toprawa> We currently have some nice MOS procedures for how to link https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3AManual_of_Style#Formatting
[10:57:44] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Manual of Style | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:58:23] <Toprawa> I am proposing an additional amendment for how (not) to link in cases of proper compound nouns
[10:58:39] <Toprawa> It looks really stupid when we link individual words of proper compound nouns
[10:58:43] <Toprawa> Like [[Star]] Destroyer
[10:58:47] <Toprawa> [[Death]] [[Star]]
[10:59:00] <Toprawa> We have no consistency for how and when we do this in articles
[10:59:11] <Toprawa> And it looks dumb to boot, as said
[10:59:15] <Toprawa> So I propose: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca
[10:59:16] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[10:59:23] <Toprawa> The bold portions will be attached to the currently existing policy
[10:59:40] <Toprawa> It allows for linking individual phrases/terms of proper compound nouns but not individual words
[10:59:48] <Toprawa> Tommy
[10:59:52] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[10:59:55] <ecks> Your editors were so preoccupied with whether or not they could link everything, they didn't stop to think if they should
[11:00:03] <Tommy-Macaroni> I've already looked over this, looks good
[11:00:04] <Toprawa> ^
[11:00:06] <Toprawa> per ecks
[11:00:15] <Imperators> I think I've seen this. :P good work.
[11:00:16] <MasterFred> Once again, looked this over prior to the meeting and love it.
[11:00:19] <Toprawa> I like to use the phrase "linking for the sake of linking"
[11:00:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> I'm not too concerned with the specific allowances, but I just want the consistency
[11:00:25] <Fan26> It's good to have firm policy on this
[11:00:28] <Toprawa> Does it actually benefit the reader to link to [[Star]] Destroyer? It doesn't.
[11:00:32] <AnilSerifoglu> ^
[11:00:36] <Toprawa> And it's distracting when you read through the article
[11:00:43] <Cwedin> ^^
[11:00:47] <ecks> is there even any documented instance of a Star Destroyer destroying a star? smh
[11:00:51] <DarthRuiz30> looks good, its better to be more careful on how we link
[11:00:52] <Toprawa> heh
[11:01:05] <Zed42> I'm for getting rid of such instances as soon as possible
[11:01:08] <GreenTentacle> Couldn't agree more.
[11:01:22] <miki> would this disallow [[Cloning|Clone]] Wars?
[11:01:29] <Imperators> yes
[11:01:30] <Shayanomer> In your Star Destroyer example, would "Star [[Destroyer]]" fall under this?
[11:01:35] <spookly> Hmm sure
[11:01:35] <ecks> Clone Wars is a proper noun
[11:01:41] <Ayrehead> Full Support
[11:01:45] <Toprawa> Shayanomer> "Destroyer" would not be linked in that example
[11:01:47] <Toprawa> Because it's one word
[11:01:56] <Shayanomer> Ok
[11:02:12] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, we all seem to have reached a conclusion on this
[11:02:17] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Manual of Style > Linking > Formatting:
[11:02:21] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:02:21] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:02:21] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:02:21] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:02:22] <miki> ~support
[11:02:23] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[11:02:23] <Imperators> ~support
[11:02:23] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:02:24] <Zed42> ~support
[11:02:24] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[11:02:24] <Toprawa> ~support
[11:02:25] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[11:02:25] <Lewisr> ~support
[11:02:25] <ecks> ~support
[11:02:25] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:02:25] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:02:25] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[11:02:25] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[11:02:25] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[11:02:25] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:02:25] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:02:26] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:02:26] <Cwedin> ~support
[11:02:26] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[11:02:27] <RattsT> ~support
[11:02:27] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[11:02:28] <Fan26> ~support
[11:02:29] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:02:30] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[11:02:30] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[11:02:31] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:02:32] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:02:32] <MasterFred> ~support
[11:02:33] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[11:02:33] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:02:34] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:02:57] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[11:03:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:03:09] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:03:09] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 17
[11:03:12] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[11:03:17] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Manual of Style > Linking > Formatting passes 17-0
[11:03:20] <Tommy-Macaroni> Our 9th item has Tope looking at something called Listen to this article. The floor is yours.
[11:03:29] <Toprawa> Oh, boy
[11:03:33] <Toprawa> Here's some entertainment
[11:03:50] <Toprawa> There used to be this thing where people would record themselves reading through articles
[11:04:04] <Toprawa> Some of them are truly hilarious with people using fake British accents
[11:04:10] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Category%3ASpoken_articles
[11:04:10] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Category:Spoken articles | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:04:22] <Toprawa> They're embarrassing at best, outdated at worst
[11:04:39] <Toprawa> As soon as you change word in an article, the audio becomes obsolete
[11:05:05] <Toprawa> I am proposing simply that we discontinue and prohibit this practice, and delete all existing audio files along with this https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Template%3ASpoken
[11:05:06] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Template:Spoken | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:05:32] <Toprawa> Tommy
[11:05:35] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[11:05:37] <ecks> Audio tracks are very 2008. What we really need is videos of people reading articles
[11:05:39] <Tommy-Macaroni> Full support
[11:05:44] <miki> I had no idea that these existed
[11:05:46] <Tommy-Macaroni> These are hilarious, but atrocious
[11:05:47] <Cwedin> RIP ice-on-a-stick
[11:05:51] <Toprawa> Listen to them now before they get deleted :P
[11:05:53] <Shayanomer> Wow those were unprofessional
[11:05:55] <Zed42> I have never seen that before. Kill it now
[11:05:56] <DarthRuiz30> Full support, I'm glad I never knew of their existance
[11:06:02] <Ayrehead> While a fun relic of the past they have no place on this wiki now
[11:06:03] <miki> there are screen readers, we don't need to provide outdated recordings
[11:06:05] <ecks> I mean, I like the concept on a very general level
[11:06:10] <ecks> but per miki, screen readers are a thing
[11:06:11] <Tommy-Macaroni> I encourage you to listen to one before they're deleted :P
[11:06:14] <Tommy-Macaroni> Good fun :P
[11:06:16] <AnilSerifoglu> ^
[11:06:29] <GreenTentacle> I forgot about these. It was never a good idea.
[11:06:34] <MasterFred> Yeah, I remember these. I think making articles accessible to the visually impaired is a worthy cause, but it's not something that can be done in this manner. It'd require some sort of Fandom feature that reads articles in their current form.
[11:06:36] <RattsT> I'm opposed to outright prohibiting this practice. Spoken articles can be important. However without proper guidelines I can't say we need these current ones.
[11:06:40] <MasterFred> So we shouldn't be attempting this.
[11:06:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> Per Fred
[11:06:59] <MasterFred> See my comment, RattsT.
[11:07:01] <spookly> Hmm yeah agreed
[11:07:14] <Tommy-Macaroni> OK, starting vote in a sec
[11:07:16] <Ayrehead> Per Fred as well
[11:07:19] <Shayanomer> I think a text-to-speech program should cover that just fine
[11:07:36] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to delete Template:Spoken and the contents of Category:Spoken article audio files:
[11:07:38] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:07:39] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:07:39] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:07:39] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:07:40] <miki> ~support
[11:07:40] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:07:40] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:07:40] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[11:07:40] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:07:40] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:07:41] <Imperators> ~support
[11:07:41] <Zed42> ~support
[11:07:41] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:07:41] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[11:07:41] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:07:42] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:07:42] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:07:42] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[11:07:43] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[11:07:44] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:07:44] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[11:07:44] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:07:46] <Cwedin> ~support
[11:07:46] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[11:07:48] <MasterFred> ~support
[11:07:48] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[11:07:49] <Lewisr> ~support
[11:07:50] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisr: Support vote counted.
[11:08:03] <spookly> ~support
[11:08:03] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[11:08:08] <ecks> ~support
[11:08:08] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[11:08:11] <Fan26> ~support
[11:08:11] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:08:47] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:08:47] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:08:47] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 16
[11:08:49] <Tommy-Macaroni> Sorry Lads
[11:09:01] <Tommy-Macaroni> Need to retake, forgot to mention we're also prohibiting this practice
[11:09:28] * Lewisrr (~Lewisr@wookieepedia/Lewisr) has joined
[11:09:29] * ChanServ gives voice to Lewisrr
[11:09:38] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from Lewisrr
[11:09:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to delete Template:Spoken and the contents of Category:Spoken article audio files and prohibit the use of spoken article audio files:
[11:09:48] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:09:48] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:09:48] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:09:49] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:09:50] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:09:50] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:09:51] <miki> ~support
[11:09:52] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[11:09:53] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:09:53] <Toprawa> ~support
[11:09:53] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:09:53] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:09:54] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[11:09:54] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:09:54] <Zed42> ~support
[11:09:54] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[11:09:56] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[11:09:56] <ecks> ~support
[11:09:56] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[11:09:56] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[11:09:57] <Fan26> ~support
[11:09:57] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:09:58] <Cwedin> ~support
[11:09:58] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[11:09:58] <Imperators> ~support
[11:09:59] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:10:05] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:10:05] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:10:07] <Lewisrr> ~support
[11:10:07] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisrr: Support vote counted.
[11:10:08] <spookly> ~support
[11:10:08] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[11:10:13] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:10:13] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[11:10:18] <Tommy-Macaroni> Closing in 10 seconds
[11:10:34] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:10:34] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:10:34] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 16
[11:10:39] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[11:10:47] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to delete Template:Spoken and the contents of Category:Spoken article audio files and prohibit the use of spoken article audio files passes 16-0
[11:10:49] * Tommy-Macaroni gives voice to Zed42
[11:10:53] <Tommy-Macaroni> Up next: Zed is discussing the dreaded Media Cat, specifically soundcat in Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Mediacat. All yours.
[11:11:04] <Zed42> good old Media Cat
[11:11:07] <Zed42> Right, this should be fairly minor
[11:11:15] <Zed42> In the last Mofference, we codified the use of {{Imagecat}} in the Layout Guide, and opted to discuss {{Soundcat}} at a later time.
[11:11:24] <Zed42> Given that the two templates have now been merged into {{Mediacat}}, now is a good time to update that paragraph.
[11:11:38] <Zed42> As such, I propose that https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia:Layout_Guide#Mediacat be revised as follows: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User:Zed42/Workbench4
[11:11:38] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:11:39] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User:Zed42/Workbench4 | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:11:46] <Zed42> Specifically, the first two sentences would read: "In the instance two or more images and/or sound files on Wookieepedia feature the article's subject, corresponding categories must be created. These must be linked to via the {{Mediacat}} template, which ideally shall be placed immediately below the title of the "Appearances" section (or the "Sources" section in the absence of an "Appearances" section) of the respective article."
[11:12:00] <Zed42> This is our current precedent, so the only real change here is in the wording of the policy.
[11:12:07] <Zed42> That's all from me
[11:12:22] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[11:12:39] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from Zed42
[11:13:09] <Toprawa> ~support :P
[11:13:10] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: There is no open vote on this channel.
[11:13:11] <Tommy-Macaroni> Looks good to me
[11:13:12] * Lewisr has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
[11:13:14] <ecks> an an aside, I think two is too little for a category, but meh
[11:13:17] <Shayanomer> Looked over that, no reason not to implement this
[11:13:21] <Ayrehead> Seems like the obvious follow up to last time
[11:13:23] <Imperators> shush :P
[11:13:32] <spookly> Just a quick tweak^^
[11:13:46] <Tommy-Macaroni> This one is easy, let's be honest
[11:13:56] <Toprawa> Category Dawgs and Media Cats
[11:13:57] <DarthRuiz30> yup
[11:14:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Mediacat with information on sound files:
[11:14:05] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:14:05] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:14:05] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:14:05] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:14:06] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[11:14:06] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[11:14:08] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:14:08] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:14:08] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:14:08] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:14:09] <Toprawa> ~support
[11:14:09] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[11:14:09] <ecks> ~support
[11:14:09] <RattsT> ~support
[11:14:09] <spookly> ~support
[11:14:09] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[11:14:09] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[11:14:10] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[11:14:10] <Imperators> ~support
[11:14:10] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:14:11] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:14:12] <Cwedin> ~support
[11:14:12] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:14:12] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[11:14:15] <Lewisrr> ~support
[11:14:15] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisrr: Support vote counted.
[11:14:16] <Fan26> ~support
[11:14:16] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:14:23] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:14:23] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:14:31] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote closing in 10 seconds
[11:14:45] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:14:46] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:14:46] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 14
[11:14:48] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[11:14:49] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:14:49] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: There is no open vote on this channel.
[11:14:55] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Wookieepedia:Layout Guide#Mediacat with information on sound files passes 14-0
[11:14:58] <Tommy-Macaroni> Too slow :P
[11:15:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> We’re nearly there. Penultimate item. Ayre is keeping with the Layout Guide to talk about infobox exclusive information. Floor is yours.
[11:15:04] <AnilSerifoglu> Heh
[11:15:24] <Ayrehead> Alright this should be fairly simple
[11:15:35] <Ayrehead> It's just codifying stuff we already do in the review boards
[11:16:16] <Ayrehead> I'm proposing we add the following two bullet point two bullet points to the infobox section of the layout guide
[11:16:16] <Ayrehead> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User:Ayrehead02/Policy
[11:16:17] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User:Ayrehead02/Policy | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:17:00] <Ayrehead> As I said, we already do this in practice, but I think it's best to have it written down somewhere, especially after I've been questioned about it several times recently
[11:17:13] <Ayrehead> That's all
[11:17:14] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[11:17:18] <ecks> kinda forgot for a second that we got rid of |era=
[11:17:23] <Toprawa> Just to clarify, we already have several things listed in the LG that don't need to be mentioned in the article from the infobox
[11:17:24] <Tommy-Macaroni> Yup, support
[11:17:26] <Zed42> These are particularly awkward to word into articles, so I agree
[11:17:27] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Wookieepedia%3ALayout_Guide#Infobox
[11:17:29] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Wookieepedia:Layout Guide | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:17:31] <Tommy-Macaroni> Nice to have this in writing
[11:17:40] <Toprawa> Battle fields, Atlas coordinates, and demonyms
[11:17:43] <Toprawa> This is adding to that list
[11:17:44] <Ayrehead> Oh yeah thanks Tope, should have linked the guide
[11:17:57] <Shayanomer> Oh I'm sure my objection is the straw that broke the camel's back on this :P
[11:18:09] <Ayrehead> It certainly contributed Shay :P
[11:18:21] <Toprawa> At some point we're just neurotically adding stuff for the sake of adding it
[11:18:30] <ecks> that's our slogan
[11:18:33] <Tommy-Macaroni> This is simple, and just adding to the list on LG
[11:18:33] <Toprawa> There's no added benefit to the reader to say an Imperial officer was part of the Imperial Officer Corps
[11:18:39] <Toprawa> It's listed in the infobox, that's all that needs to be done
[11:19:04] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote to update Layout Guide#Infobox with more items than can be infobox exclusive:
[11:19:07] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:19:07] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:19:08] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:19:08] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:19:08] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:19:09] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:19:09] <RattsT> ~support
[11:19:09] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[11:19:09] <Toprawa> ~support
[11:19:10] <Zed42> ~support
[11:19:10] <Ayrehead> Yeah "He was a stormtrooper in the Stormtrooper Corps" is redundant
[11:19:10] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[11:19:10] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[11:19:11] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:19:11] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:19:12] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:19:12] <GreenTentacle> ~support
[11:19:12] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:19:13] <Cwedin> ~support
[11:19:13] <PurpleTentacle> GreenTentacle: Support vote counted.
[11:19:13] <PurpleTentacle> Cwedin: Support vote counted.
[11:19:15] <spookly> ~support
[11:19:15] <ecks> ~support
[11:19:16] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[11:19:16] <PurpleTentacle> ecks: Support vote counted.
[11:19:17] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:19:17] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[11:19:18] <Imperators> ~support
[11:19:19] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:19:19] <Lewisrr> ~support
[11:19:19] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisrr: Support vote counted.
[11:19:21] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:19:21] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:19:29] <MasterFred> ~support
[11:19:29] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[11:19:29] <Fan26> ~support
[11:19:29] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:19:39] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote closing in 10 seconds
[11:19:52] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:19:52] <miki> ~support
[11:19:52] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:19:52] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 17
[11:19:52] <PurpleTentacle> miki: There is no open vote on this channel.
[11:19:58] <Tommy-Macaroni> Too slow :P
[11:20:00] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[11:20:09] <Tommy-Macaroni> Motion to update Layout Guide#Infobox with more items than can be infobox exclusive passes 17-0
[11:20:14] <Tommy-Macaroni> Here we are. 12/12. Last one. And who else would be rounding out tonight’s meeting but the Mofference Man, Tope :P This one’s my personal favourite: Alias articles. Floor is yours.
[11:20:22] <Toprawa> Thank you
[11:20:30] <Toprawa> Alias articles.
[11:20:33] <Toprawa> We have more than 200 of them.
[11:20:36] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Category%3AAliases%2C_nicknames%2C_and_pseudonyms
[11:20:37] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Category:Aliases, nicknames, and pseudonyms | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:20:46] <Toprawa> I don't think they need to be individual articles.
[11:20:59] <Toprawa> Why do we need 12 different pages for every alias Mara Jade used or whatever?
[11:21:11] <Toprawa> I am proposing we merge them with their main article subject.
[11:21:18] <Toprawa> However, there's a little consensus wrinkle in this one.
[11:21:31] <Toprawa> We voted on this issue once upon a time. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Forum:CT:Aliases_problem
[11:21:32] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: Forum:CT:Aliases problem | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:21:38] <Toprawa> The consensus was to keep the articles.
[11:21:39] <Toprawa> However.
[11:21:49] <Toprawa> You will see from this CT that the voting options were horribly presented.
[11:21:57] <Toprawa> The alternative to keeping was deleting them, which is ridiculous.
[11:22:07] <Toprawa> I am proposing a middle ground between Keeping and Deleting. Redirecting them.
[11:22:28] <Toprawa> Therefore, it is my opinion that this does not constitute an "overturning" of a previous consensus resolution, so the equal-or-greater-to voting policy does not apply
[11:22:46] <Toprawa> If any administrators disagree with this, please speak up now and this will be brought to a CT instead
[11:22:58] <Toprawa> The consensus rule from WP:CON reads:
[11:23:06] <Toprawa> In order to overturn a previous consensus resolution, a renewed vote must be held with a voter participation equal to or greater than the original discussion. Note that this voter-participation requirement does not apply to modifications of a previous resolution, which is defined as any change to an existing policy that is not a straight repeal.
[11:23:16] <Toprawa> I believe I am modifying this current policy, not overturning it
[11:23:22] <Toprawa> So I am going to proceed if no one objects
[11:23:24] <ecks> To be quite honest, I think it would be better to have a CT that could achieve equal-or-greater participation
[11:23:27] <ecks> sorry
[11:23:39] <Toprawa> Of course you do, ecks
[11:23:51] <Tommy-Macaroni> I have no issue with this. This isn't repealing the vote, it's finding a middle ground
[11:24:01] <Ayrehead> Yeah I'm fine with this as well
[11:24:03] <Toprawa> Regardless
[11:24:06] <Tommy-Macaroni> Imo, it's silly to just bring this to CT when we can legally pass it now
[11:24:08] <Toprawa> I'm going to propose my proposal
[11:24:12] <Toprawa> We can take a straw vote
[11:24:17] <Toprawa> https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/User_talk:Toprawa_and_Ralltiir/Zev_Senesca
[11:24:19] <Nuku-Nuku> Title: User talk:Toprawa and Ralltiir/Zev Senesca | Wookieepedia | Fandom (at starwars.fandom.com)
[11:24:39] * Cwedin has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[11:24:53] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode -m on #wookieepedia
[11:24:55] * Cwedin (~Cwedin@wookieepedia/Cwedin) has joined
[11:24:56] * ChanServ gives voice to Cwedin
[11:24:59] * Tommy-Macaroni removes voice from Cwedin
[11:25:20] <Tommy-Macaroni> Straw vote for adding an "Aliases, nicknames, and pseudonyms" section to Wookieepedia:Naming policy:
[11:25:23] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~open
[11:25:23] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~support
[11:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is open.
[11:25:23] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support vote counted.
[11:25:24] <miki> ~support
[11:25:25] <PurpleTentacle> miki: Support vote counted.
[11:25:26] <Toprawa> ~support
[11:25:26] <PurpleTentacle> Toprawa: Support vote counted.
[11:25:27] <AnilSerifoglu> ~support
[11:25:27] <PurpleTentacle> AnilSerifoglu: Support vote counted.
[11:25:27] <MasterFred> ~support
[11:25:27] <PurpleTentacle> MasterFred: Support vote counted.
[11:25:28] <Ayrehead> ~support
[11:25:28] <PurpleTentacle> Ayrehead: Support vote counted.
[11:25:30] <Shayanomer> ~support
[11:25:30] <PurpleTentacle> Shayanomer: Support vote counted.
[11:25:30] <Zed42> ~support
[11:25:31] <PurpleTentacle> Zed42: Support vote counted.
[11:25:33] <Imperators> ~support
[11:25:33] <spookly> ~support
[11:25:33] <PurpleTentacle> Imperators: Support vote counted.
[11:25:33] <PurpleTentacle> spookly: Support vote counted.
[11:25:33] <RattsT> ~support
[11:25:33] <PurpleTentacle> RattsT: Support vote counted.
[11:25:34] <Lewisrr> ~support
[11:25:34] <DarthRuiz30> ~support
[11:25:34] <PurpleTentacle> Lewisrr: Support vote counted.
[11:25:35] <PurpleTentacle> DarthRuiz30: Support vote counted.
[11:25:36] <CorellianPremier> ~support
[11:25:37] <PurpleTentacle> CorellianPremier: Support vote counted.
[11:25:45] <Fan26> ~support
[11:25:45] <PurpleTentacle> Fan26: Support vote counted.
[11:26:00] <Tommy-Macaroni> Vote closing in 10 seconds
[11:26:19] <Tommy-Macaroni> ~close
[11:26:19] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Voting is closed.
[11:26:19] <PurpleTentacle> Tommy-Macaroni: Support: 15
[11:26:22] * Tommy-Macaroni sets mode +m on #wookieepedia
[11:26:28] <Tommy-Macaroni> Straw vote to add an "Aliases, nicknames, and pseudonyms" section to Wookieepedia:Naming policy passes 15-0
[11:26:37] <Toprawa> I'll be taking this to the CT then
[11:26:44] <Toprawa> Since ecks doesn't seem to know what a "modification" means
[11:26:46] <Toprawa> But that's ok
[11:26:56] <Tommy-Macaroni> Ok
[11:27:02] <Tommy-Macaroni> That’s everything on the agenda
[11:27:08] <Tommy-Macaroni> We’ve had 12 presentations tonight so I’m going to say no to any impromptu extras, for the sake of the people who didn’t win on the timezone lottery today. Please save any additional items for CT or the next Mofference.
[11:27:13] <Tommy-Macaroni> However, while we have lots of users on here, don’t be afraid to use this opportunity to throw out any general ideas to the group to gauge opinions.
[11:27:19] <Tommy-Macaroni> Thank you everyone for coming, and thanks to all our speakers. Apologies about the spoken article revote.
[11:27:22] <Tommy-Macaroni> With that, I conclude our 32nd Mofference.