Wookieepedia:Good article nominations/Bolvan/Legends

< Wookieepedia:Good article nominations
The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a good article nomination that was successful . Please do not modify it.

Bolvan

  • Nominated by: Darth Morrt 11:08, September 26, 2010 (UTC)
  • Nomination comments: Hija's pal.

(3 ACs/3 Users/6 Total)

Support

  1. Heh. Did you know that "bolvan" means "fool" in Russian? An appropriate name for the guy… QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 19:38, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
  2. Hanzo Hasashi 21:21, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
  3. Yes! Menkooroo 00:20, November 8, 2010 (UTC)
  4. ACvote Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 20:11, January 9, 2011 (UTC)
  5. ACvote Very nice. You worked hard on these two articles, and I think they look great. Well deserving of GA status. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:32, January 15, 2011 (UTC)
  6. ACvote 1358 (Talk) 23:24, January 15, 2011 (UTC)

Object

Xd1358, quick glance
  • Check your image caption punctuation. 1358 (Talk) 19:08, September 26, 2010 (UTC)
  • "He was the commanding officer of the Imperial I-class Star Destroyer Devastator during the time of the incident in the bioweapon laboratories of Falleen, when—against Bolvan's suggestion—Sith Lord Darth Vader ordered the orbital bombardment of the planet." Loong sentence; please split.
    • Split.
  • As far as I know, all ranks should be capitalized if they are referring to an individual.
    • Fixed.
  • "When his chief gunnery officer spotted and escape pod fleeing…" Wait, what?
    • Fixed.
  • "Bolvan's instuments detected no lifeforms, so he ordered not to fire on the pod." Who ordered not to fire on the pod? Bolvan or the other guy?
    • Fixed.
  • Perhaps some more context on Vader in the bio?
    • Added.
  • That same rank issue applies for the main body as well.
    • Fixed.
  • "at the time" used twice in the bio close to each other.
    • Cut.
  • "The Devastator pursued and capturedAlderaanian Senator Leia Organa's corvette, Tantive IV, after Rebel agents transmitted to the starship the stolen plans of a new Imperial superweapon, the DS-1 Orbital Battle Station, codenamed the "Death Star."" One minor fail and then a grammar error in the middle of the sentence. I highlighted it.
    • Fixed.
  • Some underlinking and some overlinking in the bio.
    • Fixed, I think...
  • Comma issues in the P&T...
    • Fixed.
  • ..as well as in the Bts.
  • I'll read through it one more time after you have fixed these. 1358 (Talk) 18:04, October 25, 2010 (UTC)
  • Quotation marks (") go after commas and periods—check the Bts. 1358 (Talk) 11:01, October 27, 2010 (UTC)
  • "By 0 BBY, he served on the same ship as gunnery captain under Captain Mulchive Wermis during the battle of Tatooine." Somewhat confusing sentence. Perhaps "During the battle of Tatooine in 0 BBY, he was serving on the same ship as gunnery captain under Captain Mulchive Wermis." would be better?
    • Fixed.
  • "When his Chief Gunnery Officer spotted…" Not entirely sure who 'his' is referring to (Bolvan or the captain guy).
    • Fixed.
  • It's somewhat unclear that the last sentence of the intro "takes place during the battle of Tatooine." Perhaps replace with "During the battle, his…"?
    • Reworded to avoid two sentence with "During the battle..."
  • "The Sith Lord ordered Lieutenant Hija to prepare for orbital bombardment and fire on the laboratory and everything within forty kilometers.[2] Among the 200,000 Falleen casualties was the family of Prince Xizor, who later led the Black Sun criminal organization.[5]" Slightly unclear that the orbital bombardment actually happens, since you say Vader ordered him to prepare.
    • Fixed.
  • No mention of Tatooine or the battle of Tatooine in the body.
    • Fixed.
  • No mention of "instruments" that didn't detect lifeforms, neither.
  • I'll read through it one more time after you've fixed these. 1358 (Talk) 20:57, October 29, 2010 (UTC)
QGJ
  • Don't we have an article for the bombardment of Falleen? Link it. If there isn't any, create one.
    • Created.
  • Have you checked other ANH adaptations for a possible appearance? One likely source to feature him is the PhotoComic. QuiGonJinn Senate seal(Talk) 20:35, September 29, 2010 (UTC)
    • I have checked Marvel comic, Dark Horse comic, radio drama, photocomic. Nothing. Darth Morrt 18:59, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
      • I noticed that he speaks in the DH comic. Added voice only appearance. Darth Morrt 13:35, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
Jeffrey
  • Intro: "While the troops boarded the captured CR90 corvette Tantive IV"... what troops? Can you specify that they're Imperial stormtroopers?
    • Fixed.
  • Also, maybe specify in the intro that the Tantive IV belongs to the Alliance?
    • Fixed.
  • Can you clean up the last sentence of the bio? There's missing punctuation, and the mention of the Battle of Yavin is confusing without context. It might be best to explicitly mention that the stolen plans were able to help the Rebels destroy the Death Star.
    • I've tried to fix.
  • Your sourcing is really good, but reference #7 should just read Slave Ship, not The Bounty Hunter Wars: Slave Ship. Aaaand shouldn't the quote from personality and traits be sourced to The Lesser Evil?
    • Fixed.
  • "Bolvan seemed thorough and merciless" --- seemed is a little... eh. Can you reword it so as not to make an assumption? "showed thoroughness" rather than "seemed thorough" might work, and be sure to explain why he was thorough and merciless (mention in personality & traits that he wanted to incinerate the plague from orbit and was willing to commit genocide to do so).
    • Reworded.
  • "Dared to oppose" seems a little off without context as to why his opposition would be "daring". It might work if you mentioned that others who opposed Vader got Force-choked.
    • Cut. We don't have much--AFAIK any--source, that Vader choked opposing officers before 7 BBY.
      • Actually, I think you were right on the money when you originally put the bit about him opposing Vader into the p & t. I hate to see it cut entirely; it was just the "dared" bit that set off a flag for me. Sorry if I was unclear. But yeah, arguing with his superior officer is probably noteworthy. Menkooroo 04:51, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
        • Readded without 'daring'.
  • Can we really infer from a single line about conserving energy that he was "less profound" than before? Do you think that his behavior during the two incidents can be linked to each other? I don't know if the two are really related... thoughts?
    • Maybe profund is not the right word. IMO, his personality changed much during this 7 years. He lost his spirit. In 7 BBY, he is 'shot-the-fly-with-the-death-star'. By 0 BBY, he is de-commissioned from captaincy and saves some power--and maybe some paperwork.
  • Again, be sure to source the info from the revised fourth draft.
    • Done.
  • 21th?
    • Maybe this part of the Bts should be reworded. I think the destroyer in 21th is the Devastator. I asked for possible proof from CSWE.
      • Actually, I was just hoping you would take another look at it --- should be "21st," not "21th."
        • Fixed :D. Also reworded and slightly expanded.
  • That's all for now. Good work on another movie character! Menkooroo 13:26, November 2, 2010 (UTC)
  • Ola. I know I already supported, but can you clean up the bts? There's at least one spelling mistake, and it doesn't actually explicitly mention that Bolvan appeared in A New Hope. Also, is the fact that Bolvan called Hija "Terry" in Blue Harvest relevant to Bolvan's article? Menkooroo 15:45, November 29, 2010 (UTC)
    • Fixed, altough I am not sure that I've found the right spelling error. Darth Morrt 17:24, November 29, 2010 (UTC)
      • Nope, you got it. It was webside. :D Cheers! Menkooroo 00:35, December 1, 2010 (UTC)
Jujiggum
  • "Bolvan suggested the requisition of the ordnance from Project X271 and incinerate the plague from orbit…" Check your grammar here.
  • What do you mean by a "thorough" personality?
    • He would have liked to stop the plague thoroughly, to kill every lifeform to be sure. Maybe thorough is not the right word. Darth Morrt 16:45, January 2, 2011 (UTC)
      • Yeah, saying he had a "thorough personality" doesn't really mean the same thing. I would suggest saying that he was thorough in his desire to eradicate the plague, and wasn't concerned with the fact that doing so would mean killing so many beings. Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 16:55, January 2, 2011 (UTC)
  • Possibly more to come. Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 18:28, January 1, 2011 (UTC)
  • Could you give a date for the release of the 21st Marvel Comics issue? Otherwise, saying "fifteen years later" is meaningless, since we don't know either of the dates. Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 17:43, January 2, 2011 (UTC)
    • Done. Originally, I put in "fifteen year later" only to say "much later". Darth Morrt 18:00, January 2, 2011 (UTC)
Toprawa
  • Intro objections first. For starters, I don't know where you got that version of the intro quote from, but it's wrong. I suggest you pop in the DVD and look at the subtitles. Toprawa and Ralltiir 23:49, January 10, 2011 (UTC)
    • Fixed. I don't know where I got it, either. Darth Morrt 01:55, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
  • I see several bits of information from the ANH novel missing from the article. Specifically:
    • Bolvan "relax[es] considerably" after the last pockets of resistance are removed from the Tantive IV -- good P/T stuff
    • "He was listening with pleasure to the proceedings on the captured vessel" -- bio and P/T material there
    • Bolvan is described as "confident in the fire power and total control under his command," as he "casually" reads the data readouts that tell him the pod is supposedly lifeless
    • Then he "turned away to listen with satisfaction to the reports of captured men and material coming from the rebel ship." -- bio material
    • All of this is pertinent info that deserves to be included in the article for it to be considered comprehensive. Toprawa and Ralltiir 21:34, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
      • I've put in the additional info from the novel and a little bit from The Lesser Evil. Darth Morrt 16:29, January 12, 2011 (UTC)
  • Reading over the ANH novel again, I feel like his quote about "The pod's release mechanism must have short-circuited or received a false instruction" should be worked into the bio, even if we can't use the quote itself. You could say something like "He believed the pod's release mechanism must have short-circuited...etc." Toprawa and Ralltiir
  • I was about ready to support the article, but I really don't think this last bit is necessary for inclusion: "Other serving Imperial officers aboard the Devastator who wore their hair in this fashion included Commander Nahdonnis Praji and Lieutenant Hija." Mentioning his sideburns is fine, but that last sentence is really extraneous. You should, however, also include that in Hija's P/T. Toprawa and Ralltiir 04:14, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
  • If you're going to include that image of the Falleen bombardment, please at least upload a new version with the borders fully cropped out. Toprawa and Ralltiir 04:17, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
    • Done. I've also added info from a Fact File, related to the gun crew. The current word count is 970. Do you think it could be stretched to 1000 to became eligible for FAN? Darth Morrt 07:42, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
  • In response to your latest post, I don't see how you could legitimately pull another 30 words out of this article without adding unnecessary fluff, which you seem to be getting into now with all of this extraneous source information not directly tied to Bolvan. I would not recommend trying to go that route. I'm somewhat skeptical about the latest inclusion of this gunnery crew info, and I would ask you to please post the original source information you got this from for my benefit. For the record, I would like to consider this a formal objection until I'm satisfied with the presentation of this information. Toprawa and Ralltiir 18:57, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
    • There is a picture of Bolvan. The image caption says: "Gunnery officer: The ships 120 primary weapons required 275 gunners to operate them. The gun crews had a surprising amount of autonomy - a bad judgement by a single member of one of them was instrumental in allowing the Death Star plans to fall into the hands of the Rebel Alliance." Darth Morrt 19:35, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
      • I understand where you're coming from with this, but I don't think the way you've chosen to assert this information in the bio can necessarily be interpreted like that. Specifically the bit about not contacting a superior officer. That doesn't seem analogous with the fact that he's in command of the gunnery crews, and therefore is essentially the highest authority in this area. Instead, I would probably recommend trying to work that information exclusively into the P/T, rather than the bio. Just mention the fact that the Devastator's gunnery crews had a surprising amount of autonomy, and Bolvan's poor judgment allowed the droids to escape, but don't get into extrapolating about not contacting superior officers. Toprawa and Ralltiir 19:20, January 15, 2011 (UTC)
Xd1358, round two
  • Should the Imperial Navy be listed in the infobox as an affiliation? 1358 (Talk) 19:00, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
    • I've been informed this is optional by another user, but I'll leave it up to you. For the record, I would prefer to have it included. 1358 (Talk) 19:07, January 13, 2011 (UTC)

Comments

Approved as a Good article by AgriCorps 23:24, January 15, 2011 (UTC)


I need help with the Sources and Appearances sections. Bolvan was first named as Bolvan in the SOTES, but it was unclean, whether he is the black-uniformed officer from ANH. The Visual Guides make it clear. Which shoud get the '1stID' tag? Darth Morrt 14:45, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

  • I think what you have at present is spot on. Toprawa and Ralltiir 21:35, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
  • Not an objection and I know I already support this, but see what I had to say on Forum:SH:Contradictory movie adaptation quotes. Note that months ago I tried getting rid of the contradiction and it was reverted. The thing with the contradictory quote is, in the movie, which is the greatest form of canon, Bolvan never says, "Don't waste your power." The contradicting quotes are a lesser level in the "hierarchy of canon," and Bolvan could not have simultaneously said, "Hold your fire, there's no life forms, it must have short circuited" and "Hold your fire, Lieutenant Hija, don't waste your power." The only thing that I would consider canon is the fact Bolvan wanted to conserve laser power not alongside the contradicting quote. I would like to hear your thoughts, though. And let me reiterate this is not an objection, and you still have my support. Hanzo Hasashi 20:00, January 14, 2011 (UTC)
    • I agree that movie quotes are higher canon. However, in this case, my interpretation is this: "Hold your fire, Lieutenant Hija. Instruments show no life forms aboard. The pod's release mechanism must have short-circuited or received a false instruction. [Here the scene ends, and the last sentence is said offscreen.] Don't waste your power." The first three sentences are overruled by the film, but the last is not. IMO, if a novel quote is not a reworded version of a movie quote, then it can be understand as a minor cut-scene, even in the middle of a scene. Darth Morrt 00:06, January 15, 2011 (UTC)