- The following discussion is preserved as an archive of a featured article nomination that was successful. Please do not modify it.
Sith magic
- Nominated by:—Tommy 9281 01:19, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Nomination comments: Something I've wanted to do since I first began my Wookieepedia career.
(4 Inqs/2 Users/6 Total)
Support
Pre-nommed. A great undertaking, this is one of the most comprehensive and informative Force-related articles I've ever read. Xicer9
(Combadge) 03:00, July 14, 2010 (UTC)- A most impressive article. Very good! :) —Obi–wan Jacobi
(Talk) 03:57, July 14, 2010 (UTC) - Awesome stuff, Tommy.--Jedi Kasra (comlink) 17:41, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
Boom. Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 22:53, July 19, 2010 (UTC)- — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 02:00, August 21, 2010 (UTC)
- Cylka-talk- 00:50, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Object
Jujiggum
Just a few: where does it say that Korsin used magic to trick the Keshiri? IIRC, they automatically believed the Humans were the Skyborn, due to their apparent coming from among the stars, wielding the Force, and their lightsabers. (Apologies if my memory is failing, here)- No, you are correct. Addressed.
Why aren't the One Sith noted in the "affiliation" field of the infobox? You say that Wyyrlok and Maladi practiced Sith magic.Would Bane's study of essence transfer be notable? Also, I think that Sidious' as well as Set Harth's study of that power would be particularly notable (right now I only see Sidious' mastery of essence transfer noted in his image caption).- I asked a few other Inqs and the consensus was that mentioning all of them was not necessary. I instead included those mentions in the "LikeMyBody?" reftag.
- That's all I've got. Truly exceptional and fantastic work, Tommy. Jonjedigrandmaster (Talk) 22:18, July 19, 2010 (UTC)
Fiolli's Pasta Bowl
Not much, so let's get this show on the road:
"…only a being possessed of considerable willpower had any hope of resisting its psychological effects." This clause does not quite make sense. I'm also not sure how it should be semicolon-connected.- Addressed.
In the second paragraph of "Nature," is there a reason why Dllr Nep and Oron Kira are pipelinked as opposed to outright listed?- Addressed.
"Its limitless power…" Does the source actually say that it is limitless? Perhaps, it "seemed" limitless to the Naddists?- The source actually does say that, but it was kind of unnecessary, so I took it out. Addressed.
- I find this highly interesting, and while I understand why it was removed, perhaps there is value in retaining it since it is explicit in the source material. Ponder it over. Should you add it back, I have no objection to it. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 21:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- The source actually does say that, but it was kind of unnecessary, so I took it out. Addressed.
"By the time of the rise of Darth Krayt's One Sith Order, Sith magic had been all but consigned to obscurity." First, this should be a separate paragraph. More importantly, the chronological gap seems missing. There are instances of Sith magic in between (Sidious, Durron, etc.) that are even mentioned in the article. Is there a way to make this chronological connection more smooth so that these things are at least recognized at this point as having been around even if the skill-set was fading into obscurity? Use the sentence "Kun was eventually defeated by Durron's classmates, his spirit was forever destroyed, and Sith magic again was left without any known practitioners." that is sourced to Champions of the Force as proof of the obscurity. Having this mentioned twice in this article is definitely neither detrimental nor redundant as context varies.- Well see, that part of the article falls under the "Fear of Sith magic" section. That particular paragraph discusses the Sith's fear of Sith magic, which is why it jumps from Bane's fear to that of the One Sith. Because it was so obscure in the timeframe in-between, most folks didn't even know of its existence enough to fear it. I did break the One Sith part into its own paragraph though, and I also added a sentence to the preceding paragraph that talks briefly about the Jedi's fear of Sith magic during the Clone Wars. "Fear of Sith magic again began to trouble the Jedi by that time, as they suspected that the powers of the dark side were on the verge of throwing the Force into complete disarray." See if that works, and if not, I'll try something else.—Tommy 9281 17:58, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
- I see, and I like the addition. My only suggestion, then, is that either at the end of the Bane/Zannah paragraph or at the start of the Krayt paragraph, a sentence is listed that mentions that those in the line of Bane (Plagueis, Sidious) were still not-publicly-known practitioners as they are in the direct religious lineage. Also, I would suggest this be alluded to in the introduction as well, since it totally skips these, and the average "Joe/Jane" looking in the article might want to be aware of it. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 21:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I worked up a few things in the "Fear" section, see how you like that. As for the intro, is "Still, the allure of Sith magic survived through the fall of the Republic in 19 BBY and the subsequent Galactic Civil War, and curious Force-sensitives learned to harness its power from obscure temples on long-forgotten planets and moons." not sufficient? Please advise, thanks.—Tommy 9281 22:34, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Basically, just clause that gives a glancing blow that still addresses the practice by Plagueis and Sidious rather than simply the "fear" of it. That's all, just a quick clause or something like that. I'm going to vote in favor because it's not something I would consider an objection at this point, although I would prefer it be done. Just a thought. Nice work, Tommy. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 02:00, August 21, 2010 (UTC)
- I worked up a few things in the "Fear" section, see how you like that. As for the intro, is "Still, the allure of Sith magic survived through the fall of the Republic in 19 BBY and the subsequent Galactic Civil War, and curious Force-sensitives learned to harness its power from obscure temples on long-forgotten planets and moons." not sufficient? Please advise, thanks.—Tommy 9281 22:34, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I see, and I like the addition. My only suggestion, then, is that either at the end of the Bane/Zannah paragraph or at the start of the Krayt paragraph, a sentence is listed that mentions that those in the line of Bane (Plagueis, Sidious) were still not-publicly-known practitioners as they are in the direct religious lineage. Also, I would suggest this be alluded to in the introduction as well, since it totally skips these, and the average "Joe/Jane" looking in the article might want to be aware of it. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 21:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Well see, that part of the article falls under the "Fear of Sith magic" section. That particular paragraph discusses the Sith's fear of Sith magic, which is why it jumps from Bane's fear to that of the One Sith. Because it was so obscure in the timeframe in-between, most folks didn't even know of its existence enough to fear it. I did break the One Sith part into its own paragraph though, and I also added a sentence to the preceding paragraph that talks briefly about the Jedi's fear of Sith magic during the Clone Wars. "Fear of Sith magic again began to trouble the Jedi by that time, as they suspected that the powers of the dark side were on the verge of throwing the Force into complete disarray." See if that works, and if not, I'll try something else.—Tommy 9281 17:58, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
"…atramentous mists of pure dark side energy…" Atramentous? That's not quite a word. What mean you here?- Addressed.
"…there was a great possibility that they would descend into utter hysteria." Who's the they?- Addressed.
"…not just of the body, but also the spirit." This offset clause is a hanging clause that does not quite fit. Please rework this.- Addressed.
"These could both be instances of Sith magic, since sources such as the Tales of the Jedi Companion and The Dark Side Sourcebook associate such abilities with Sith magic." I understand where you are going with this, and it is in the Bts, but could this sound less speculative?- Addressed.
- In general, some of the footnotes that give specific examples might be better served worked into the mainline prose. I am not objecting to any one in particular, but please reconsider them as a couple of them would support the IU perspective better if adjusted. Otherwise, nice work. I very much like that each individual thing is sourced as opposed to tacking five ref tags at the end of the paragraph. Excellent. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 02:18, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
- I eliminated a few and incorporated a few, see how that works. The second Jedi to express his interest in the magic of the ancient Sith ;). Thanks as always for the review, Master Fiolli. Please advise if anything further is required.—Tommy 9281 18:39, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
- Much better, but one last minor thing with this: I'm curious, however, as to why "PassItOn" was removed outright: "Sith magic was passed on to Aleema and Satal Keto by way of a Sith spellbook in the Tales of the Jedi: The Freedon Nadd Uprising 2: Initiates of the Sith, and Exar Kun learned of Naga Sadow and his power base on Yavin 4 from a scroll he found in Freedon Nadd's sarcophagus in the Dark Lords of the Sith audio drama." This one seems cool, and the information is more than relevant to the article. — Fiolli {Alpheridies University ComNet} 21:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I eliminated a few and incorporated a few, see how that works. The second Jedi to express his interest in the magic of the ancient Sith ;). Thanks as always for the review, Master Fiolli. Please advise if anything further is required.—Tommy 9281 18:39, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
Cylka
Please add that Sith sorcery is the same as Sith magic into the main article, as you did in the intro.- Addressed.
Could you add a date for the Naddist Uprising. I would have done it myself, but i was unsure as to which ref to use.- No worries, addressed.
I'm wondering if Nadd should be introduced as Ommin's ancestor as well as Master instead of later on.- Addressed.
and warned the girl about attempting to use her charms against him, lest Bane destroy her - I'm wondering if this last part needs to be included since it is more about Bane and Zannah's relationship than Sith magic.the spell violently repelled the Force probe of the healer Caleb's shack by The Huntress - It may just be me, but I'm not quite sure what this means.- Other than these few minor points, I think that this article is fantastic. It was a truly interesting read and one of your best to date. Cylka-talk- 03:25, August 22, 2010 (UTC)
Comments
- Special thanks to Master Jonathan, Eyrezer, Lord Hydronium, Dark Lord Trayus, Jedi Kasra, QuiGonJinn and Xicer9, all of whom helped me make this possible.—Tommy 9281 01:19, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Also, for those who might object to the absence of roleplaying game stats/mechanics: it was removed after I was advised that the stats included within The Dark Side Sourcebook had been since rendered obsolete with the release of the Saga Edition Core Rulebook. Otherwise, enjoy!—Tommy 9281 01:19, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Oh yeah, and Redemption has been contacted for better quality scans.—Tommy 9281 01:41, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
Approved as a Featured article by Inquisitorius 00:50, August 24, 2010 (UTC)