Talk: Zez-Kai Ell

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Lightsaber style

It has probably been discussed hundreds of times already, but can we say for sure which master used which form? You know, the form he teaches to the Exile depends on the order he visits the planets, and also his class. - TopAce 13:41, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

• Good point. - Sikon [Talk] 18:48, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
  • But, if we exept that what the official strategy guide says is canon (as is the case with the A-wing military fighter (Galactic Republic)), then cannonicaly, Zez-Kai Ell used Ataru. The Official game guide for KOTOR II says (on page 128) that Zez-Kai Ell used Ataru, saying: "Use Zez-Kai Ell's Ataru stance against him" and: "You learn the lightsaber stance Ataru after meeting with Zez-Kai Ell". So, if what the game guide says is canon (as it has been stated in the above linked A-wing military fighter article) then canonicaly, Ataru was Zez-Kai Ell's lightsaber form. Therefore, I am going to remove mention of Shien, since a canon source says he used Ataru. 141.154.183.205 05:02, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
    • Mmm, if that's true then the Exile's training couldn't be Consular-Jedi Master, with those classes the masters teach you just force forms - interesting. --Jinger 08:16, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
      • It also implies (since the order is Ataru - Shien - Juyo/Niman) that Exile visited Nar Shaddaa before Dantooine or the second trip to Onderon. - Sikon [Talk] 09:36, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
        • Impications, yes. But it still doesn't firmly state that the Exile was a Guardian and she visited Nar Shaada first (or before the second part of Onderon). At any rate, the official game guide is only one source which could be flawed. We cannot be sure, but somehow it suggests to me that initially, each master had a fixed lightsaber form which they teach to the Exile. So what I mean is that you could learn Shien - Juyo/Niman - Ataru, in this order, if the masters have had a fixed lightsaber form. Of course this is only a theory. At any rate, since this is the only source we have at our disposal, I suggest we keep Ataru under any circumstance. - TopAce 10:12, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

On Council during Jedi Civil War?

Zez-Kai Ell tells the Exile that the day the Council exiled her is the day he decided to the the Order. Now, if I take that as to mean what it sounds like, then he is telling yoiu that he also was no longer a member of the Jedi Council... since it was because the counil that he left, and you can't really be a member of the council without being a member of the Jedi Order.

That being said, I am removing mention that Master Ell was a member of the council during the Jedi Civil War. One reason is because there are no facts to back it up, and because he left the council and Order shortly after the end of the Mandalorian Wars, which was a while before the start of the Jedi Civil War.--Master Dakari 00:02, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

mabey but wasn't he in the council meeting if he wasn't a jedi? are you sure he didn't say something like him leaving the order i don't excalty what he saidGroode hdoge 00:51, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes, he says:

He later even tells the Exile, "Make no mistake, I am no Jedi." However, when the Council decided to convene on Dantooine, he took up his duties again; even wearing his Jedi Master Robes again. But no, he did not serve on the Council during the Jedi Civil War. He says so himself; he voluntarily left the Order as soon as the Mandalorian Wars came to a close.--Master Dakari 02:11, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Stroth similarities

Perhaps bushy moustaches and receding long hair were just "in" around 4000 BBY.

"There's still an opportunity to kill Ell"

Is it just me, or does that sound kinda biased against the poor guy? KEJ 16:10, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

No that is what he desrevs he treid to kill you —Unsigned comment by 68.58.59.206 (talk • contribs)

along with the rest of the council

Wise Jedi

When I first meet this jedi he seemed very wise. He even adimtted that they did not Exile me for the wars. So I was stunned when he tried to cut me off. I mean its not my fault they were scared that I might change them —Unsigned comment by 68.58.59.206 (talk • contribs)

Leave him alone —Unsigned comment by 68.58.59.206 (talk • contribs)

I agree he really sucks —Unsigned comment by 69.217.73.2 (talk • contribs)

• Zez-Kai Ell is the most likeable of the jedi masters with the possible exception of Lonna Vash, who is found dead in the game. He is far more sympathetic to the exile's situation and willing to accept his own flaws and those of the jedi council. He seems to be in some ways a representative of those "lost jedi" who left the order in disappointment after the Jedi Civil War. But at the same time, his weakness is that he is not terribly brave. He was too afraid to insist the council act when it cast out the exile, and while he sympathizes with her situation, he is too cowed by Vrook and possibly Kavar to stand up for her. Jediphile 17:02, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

What I still don't understand is Zez Kai Ell seems symphatetic to the Exile, and Kavar seems to be good friends with her too, but at the Jedi Enclave they still agree with Vrook to cut off her connection to the force. why? —Unsigned comment by 98.142.79.203 (talk • contribs)

• Self preservation. Like they said, they see the death of the force within the Exile, and they just can't let that happen. OLIOSTER ^(talk) 20:45, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

I will admit, Ell and Kavar are my favorite of the three jedi. Vrook's a jerk in the first and second KOTOR. taylorbeaty

Refugee?

I'm not sure that you could call Zez-Kai Ell a refugee on Nar Shaddaa. He really wasn't an asylum seeker. He went there for his own reasons and I believe that in the game he admits to ignoring the refugees. * Cylka * 11:33, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Well, he fled from Coruscant to Nar Shardaa in order to hide from the Sith, and he resided in the Refugee sector. Also I could be wrong but I thought he was helping the Refugee's. Jayce Carver 11:37, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

• OK I can see where you're coming from. I did find some of Zez-Kai Ell's dialog that makes me think that he lived there, but wasn't associated with them.
  "I have watched you as you have traveled the Refugee Sector. I've seen what you have done... what I refused to do." -- "If anything, you should know that your actions have convinced me I can stand by and watch no longer." -- "Somehow, they... we... are being targeted through the Force - and when Jedi gather, we are vulnerable. So we have chosen places where it is difficult to sense others through the Force... whether on planets dense with life, or touched by war. In such places, we may conceal ourselves, gather information - without presenting ourselves as targets. It was part of Kavar's plan." -- "And the strong currents of life here on Nar Shaddaa make perceiving a Force user difficult. I could use it to cloak my movements and watch without being discovered."
  And yes he did admit to hiding, but that seemed to be kind of an afterthought to me. * Cylka * 12:14, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Ah, you were right about him not helping the others. I still think he can be classed as a refugee though, as he was fleeing the war. And he certainately lived like a refugee. Jayce Carver 12:18, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

• Actually, the evidence that Zez-Kai Ell may have helped at times comes from Visquis of all people. When the exile confronts Visquis in his lair under the Jekk'Jekk Tarr, he mentions how the exile has helped the refugees and is then surprised when the exile answers that she has only been on Nar Shaddaa for a short while. That leads Visquis to conclude that there could be truth to the rumors that another jedi is on Nar Shaddaa. Jediphile 16:58, 11 August 2009 (UTC)