Forum:TC:The Saga Begins

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This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was keep. Graestan(Talk) 03:40, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

The Saga Begins (song) (talk - history - links - logs)

I see no point in this having its own page. It and Yoda (song) should be merged onto List of references to Star Wars in music. The impact of these songs on the world when it comes to Star Wars is completely insignificant. I didn't even know "The Saga Begins" existed until last year. Graestan(Talk) 19:06, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

Merge and delete

  1. Graestan(Talk) 19:06, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

Keep

  1. It is interesting to read and is too big to be merged with the list article. MauserComlink 19:32, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
  2. It's has enough content, and its fairly interesting. —Lucius malfoy7 Talk • Reference 21:54, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
  3. I'm OK with keeping the page, but I think the "Star Wars References" section is excessive/unneeded. - Esjs(Talk) 22:08, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
  4. NighthawkLeader 22:19, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
  5. Golden Monkey 23:22, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
  6. —Xwing328(Talk) 22:17, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
  7. Let me make an example of how I think we should do it with the real world songs. For example, compare the songs Californication and The Saga Begins. In Californication, the only reference to Star Wars is the line "Alderaan's not far away". Besides this small reference, the song is about something totally different and should just be mentioned in the List of references to Star Wars in music. If you take a look at "The Saga Begins", you see that there's much more than just such a small reference. The whole lyrics and the music video is a reference to Star Wars, and should be kept. Also, such an article has the potential to become a nice FA. Pranay Sobusk ~ Talk 18:40, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
  8. Popularity today does not equal notability. As an encyclopedia, we do not write for a particular time period. This was a big enough deal ten years ago, so it is notable today. Also, this cannot be merged to the references page, as it is too long; we have precedent for keeping such long articles separate.-LtNOWIS 08:35, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
  9. Second choice would be merging "Yoda (song)" and "The Saga Begins (song)" to "Weird Al" Yankovic, rather than clogging the references article. —Silly Dan (talk) 12:04, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
  10. Per Pranay.--ToRsO bOy 14:01, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
  11. JMAS Hey, it's me! 02:33, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
  12. Wookieepedia should cover all aspects of SW, not only in-universe stuff and sources. We have articles about lots of fan films, so why not one about a SW parody song that was shown on various music television channels back in '99? --Craven 03:14, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
  13. Fourdot's logic won out. Graestan(Talk) 03:37, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

Neutral

  1. I'm not sure on this. I had heard of it before and even watched it on YouTube, but I'm not sure if it is worth having its own article or not, so I'll vote here unless convinced otherwise. Master JonathanJedi Council Chambers 06:54, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
  2. You know, I rarely vote against any deletion, and I never vote against the deletion of fan projects, but this is an unusual case. As long as we don't have a hard-and-fast policy against fanfilms, parodies, etc., I can't see how this is any less deserving of an article than any other existing fan-work. It seems to me that since this is more mainstream than most parodies/fanworks, and given its interesting backstory, this is actually more deserving of an article than most similar things. Until we have a proper policy on this whole mess, I can't vote to delete. I won't vote to keep, since I think we need a policy to purge ALL this crap, but for consistency's sake I can't vote delete. -- Darth Culator (Talk) 13:39, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
  3. IFYLOFD (You will pay the price for your lack of vision!) 22:38, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
  4. Chack Jadson (Talk) 21:10, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
  5. Undecided on this one. However, as a personal note, I would like to see the article renamed (if kept) to The Saga Begins (song), and the short story The Saga Begins by Timothy Zahn be moved to The Saga Begins. - Cavalier OneFarStar(Squadron channel) 07:52, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
    • I fully support Cavalier on this one. Licensed work should take superiority over other projects. MauserComlink 12:19, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Discussion

  • It is a Star Wars themed song by a very well-known, popular artist. And like the article says, it was quite a phenomenon for the particularly accurate lyrics, which had to be written before he saw the movie. The sections on the verses should probably be removed because we're not a lyrics database, but one user having never heard of it is not a reason to delete an article on a notable real-world SW topic. 76.6.4.125 19:54, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
    • You can put almost everything of any actual worth into the references page; there's no need for an abundance of articles on songs about Star Wars. And the fact that I hadn't heard of it is a pretty solid litmus test for the song 1. sucking and 2. not actually being popular. Weird Al, except for the extremely rare rip that makes people laugh just enough, is not popular whatsoever anymore. Graestan(Talk) 20:21, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
  • We really just need to create a separate wiki, like we did with the Merchandise Wiki, for fan-created projects. Then everyone gets what they want: all the fan projects can be kept in full, and the people who don't want to see them because they're crap don't have to. Toprawa and Ralltiir 20:02, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
    • Actually, I think a SW fan wiki exists. I'm not sure of the url, but I remember seeing it on Wikia requests awhile back. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Talk page) 20:21, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
      • But it's not our fan wiki, which is the point. The Merchandise Wiki is a self-described "sister project" of Wookieepedia, created by our own people, which is what we need for fan content. Toprawa and Ralltiir 22:11, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

You should look into Star Wars Kid instead, that one I would delete on sight. MauserComlink 04:50, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

  • Personally I find that this is more notable than many other articles in Category:Parodies NighthawkLeader 12:50, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
  • Another option is to combine the Weird Al songs into one article. I think they are notable enough to keep in some form, though. --Eyrezer 08:05, 6 May 2009 (UTC)