This page is an archive of a community-wide discussion. This page is no longer live. Further comments or questions on this topic should be made in a new Senate Hall page rather than here so that this page is preserved as a historic record. Graestan(Talk) 00:08, 31 October 2008 (UTC)
Hi, everybody. Haven't been on the site in a while, good to be back. Anyway, I think that given the new info we have on Darth Traya from the Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide, it is appropriate to change the article's name to "Darth Traya". Anyone else agree?--Jedi Kasra (talk) 15:51, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
Well I believe that depends on whether we usually use the Darth titles in the names of the pages. In this page, for example, the original name is used. But here, we use the Darth name. 70.26.54.186 16:17, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
- True, but it says that "Traya", not Kreia, revealed herself as a Sith at the end of the Exile's adventures.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 16:19, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
- I think the general convention used is that the article title is the name the person is known at as the time of their death. For example, Anakin Skywalker had been redeemed before he died, but (possible spoiler) Darth Caedus had not. As for the use of names within an article, I always thought the convention was that the name the person used at the time was used. I haven't played KOTOR II, but if Kreia went by Kreia when she revealed this fact, then the article is mis-written.Taral, Dark Lord of the Sith 16:52, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
- It's at Kreia, and is most likely going to stay there. Chack Jadson (Talk) 18:43, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
- Then are we dismissing canon, which is what the book is? I don't understand.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:24, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
She died as Darth Traya, so the article should be titled that. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 17:36, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
- Thank you. That's exactly what teh campaign guide says, too. We should probably have a vote on this, though seeing as the guide says she did, I don't see why we really need one.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:54, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
- Actually, Taral was a bit off. The general rule of thumb at the moment is not the name they used when the died, but the name they were most known by, or the name by which they self-identified. Their "public face" if you will. Hence Dooku, Palpatine and Darth Bane, as well as Anakin Skywalker, Reven and Darth Malak. Since she was known as Kreia by the majority of her peers, in the majority of her appearences, the article stays at Kreia. (or at least that was how the Krayt/Hett article was decided) Din's Fire 997 05:54, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
As far as I'm aware Dooku and Palpatine are so because it could'nt be determined which name they died under. They both used their real names publicly, and also maintained a Darth name behind the scenes. Seeing as it was impossible to tell which name they were using when they died we used the names they were best known by. Anakin was definately better known as Darth Vader, yet the article isn't titled so because he died as Anakin. Same with Darth Caedus, he was best known as Jacen, however he died as Caedus so that's what the article is called. I understand when there is debate about what name they died under, however in this case we have two solid canon sources that say she died as Darth Traya, the game, and now the guide as well. So there really is nothing to discuss. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 08:23, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
- Here's the last two paragraphs on her in the book:
"As Sion and Nihilus unwittingly aid her by carrying out a massive assassination campaign against the Jedi, Traya seeks the Jedi Exile. Together forging a telepathic link, they revitalize their Force connections. In the Jedi Exile, who had wounded the Force at Malachor V, Traya believes she has found a way to destroy all traitors, including the Force itself. Traya manipulates the Exile into finding the surviving Jedi masters and Traya's Sith apprentices so that Traya can destroy them."
"At last, Traya reveals herself as a Sith, but the Jedi Exile refuses her invitation to join the dark side. Traya uses vast telekinetic powers to wield a trio of lightsabers against her, but she is ultimately killed by the person she considered her greatest disciple."
That is good enough reason to change the article's name to "Darth Traya" I believe.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 17:33, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
I believe that seals the deal, yes. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 17:48, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
- Great. Now all we need is an administrator's approval.--Jedi Kasra (talk) 18:01, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
- Whoa, whoa, whoa. As long as I thought we were discussing article theory this was fine, but if you're actually attempting a petition to change Kreia/Traya, you need to talk about it on the article's discussion page, not here. The people who crafted the article (and decided to put it a Kreia in the first place) know this argument way better than either of us do, and must be consulted before anything rash. Two users and a theroetical admin is not enough on an article of this importance. Din's Fire 997 18:43, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
I would have hoped that canon would be enough. Also it was decided to move Jacen Solo to Darth Caedus through a forum discussion so why not Kreai? Any old argument about what she died as is rendered completely irrelevent by the guide. She calls herself Darth Traya at the end of the game for crying out loud, what more do we need. There must always be a Darth Traya. Atris was unsuitable for the role, so, once again it falls to me. –K.A.J•T•C•E• 08:48, 11 October 2008 (UTC)