While more generally considering our coverage of OOU topics, I've realised that one of the most obvious things we're missing is the ability to list all of the OOU topics mentioned in media. As we know from our in-universe appearances lists, these can be extremely useful for quickly making sure there is evidence on the wiki that a piece of media should be checked when someone writes up or researches the topic in future as they ensure that the topic will appear in the WhatLinksHere list for an article even if it isn't listed in the articles sources or appearances. They are especially useful when the topic in question is a redlink and so has no sources or appearances list to add to.
As such, VergenceScatter very kindly put together Template:OOUappearances for me, which I've tested out on The Star Wars Archives: Episodes I–III, 1999–2005 with the mentions from the first section of the book. Note that my intention is that this only be used to cover the content of a piece of media, not contain the credits or cast of those involved in its production (Paul Duncan is included in the Archives list as he is mentioned in-text within the book during interviews etc.) as for those we already have Template:Credits or appropriate infobox fields.
Before this is more widely implemented and any potential layout guide changes are made, I'd love to hear others thoughts and input. One thing I haven't quite worked out my stance on yet is subjects mentioned in the book but not directly in relation to Star Wars. For example, there is a section in Archives covering how technology used in Star Wars was pioneered in making The Abyss by people who would go on to work on Star Wars. As part of this James Cameron is mentioned purely as the director of The Abyss and how he interacted with the technology. Now I don't think there's any need for us to have a James Cameron article just because he's mentioned in an official book, but would it be useful for us to include him in appearances with a link to a Wikipedia article? Or to have a non-linked list of "non-Star Wars people" or something? That way, in future people won't just think he's been missed and add him to the list. It also means that if he does become notable enough in some way to make an article in future, people would be more easily able to find that he was mentioned in this and so know to check it in order to see if it can be used for referencing or anything else. Ayrehead02 (talk) 10:57, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Full support overall. However, I'm conflicted regarding your last paragraph, for the reasons you exposed yourself. And since in recent years, we've made a few "exclusionist" policy changes regarding non-SW content in OOU pages, I'd be inclined to follow through with a no on non-SW content to this new appearances list. Furthermore, looking at my shelf, I can see a few books where allowing non-SW content could lead to some abuse: George Lucas: The Creative Impulse or From Star Wars to Indiana Jones: The Best of the Lucasfilm Archives for example. Also, is there any reason why there is no parameter for "media", could be useful on books like Star Wars Year by Year. --NanoLuukeCloning facility 11:25, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Yeah there's certainly some sources that would cause issues with long non-Star Wars list. I guess my other concern is that it leaves a level of subjectivity in what names to include and not include, but I guess that's no different from people deciding what topics are notable and not-notable in universe for the other sections. As to a media section, this was also briefly discussed in Discord, but neither I or Vergence had any strong feelings on it. I can't think of any super strong arguments for or against, although I suppose since we have bibliography sections on media articles which could list this in the same way as a sources or appearances section it would be consistent to include it. Ayrehead02 (talk) 11:51, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- A separate "Media" section makes sense to me, given the number of Star Wars media with articles here that exist to either catalog or provide extra information on other SW media. Perhaps a separate "Miscellanea" section as well, if such things have articles here? SorcererSupreme21 (talk) 12:39, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Actually Miscellanea would make sense for stuff like Holocron continuity database so that's a great idea. Ayrehead02 (talk) 12:46, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Me and Vergence were discussing this on the template's talk page. I support the addition of media and miscellanea sections on this thing. SilverSunbird (talk) 17:19, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Actually Miscellanea would make sense for stuff like Holocron continuity database so that's a great idea. Ayrehead02 (talk) 12:46, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- A separate "Media" section makes sense to me, given the number of Star Wars media with articles here that exist to either catalog or provide extra information on other SW media. Perhaps a separate "Miscellanea" section as well, if such things have articles here? SorcererSupreme21 (talk) 12:39, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Yeah there's certainly some sources that would cause issues with long non-Star Wars list. I guess my other concern is that it leaves a level of subjectivity in what names to include and not include, but I guess that's no different from people deciding what topics are notable and not-notable in universe for the other sections. As to a media section, this was also briefly discussed in Discord, but neither I or Vergence had any strong feelings on it. I can't think of any super strong arguments for or against, although I suppose since we have bibliography sections on media articles which could list this in the same way as a sources or appearances section it would be consistent to include it. Ayrehead02 (talk) 11:51, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- I support this idea as well. Given how long the Bibliography-now-Sources section has been a thing, it makes sense to finally have a proper OOU {{App}} counterpart. Although there must be a less clunky section name than "Out-of-universe appearances"... SorcererSupreme21 (talk) 12:39, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- Yeah I don't love that name either and am keen for suggestions since I couldn't think of anything better. Ayrehead02 (talk) 12:46, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- I think as long as we have strict usage so it doesnt get abused then its great. For example, only those media in Category:Real-world reference books should probably use it, but the star wars archives arent listed in that category, perhaps because the category description gives the inpression it is for books solely dedicated to the naming of. Manoof (he/him/his) (talk) 22:50, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
- We should keep it strict, but there's definitely other valid uses for stuff outside of that category including large amounts of content from Insider magazine, plus things like The Star Wars Book and Star Wars: Absolutely Everything You Need to Know that mix out of universe and in universe content throughout the book. Ayrehead02 (talk) 00:01, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
- There's a bunch of StarWars.com articles, namely the Star Wars Inside Intel and Ships of the Galaxy columns, which could also use this template. SilverSunbird (talk) 04:09, 19 February 2022 (UTC)