Forum:CT:Races and species categorization revamp

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The result of the debate was recategorization proceeds. —Silly Dan (talk) 01:54, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

The current Category:Races and species is a mess, and has a silly name. I propose we revamp the whole thing. My proposal:

Oh, and recategorizing all the species, etc. wouldn't be a problem. We have bots, after all. Thoughts, comments, suggestions? --Imp 02:02, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I was going to start a thread about this, but you beat me to it. Here's the scheme I was thinking of:

  1. Category:Races and species should be renamed: but not to Category:Species, since that doesn't properly specify that we want intelligent aliens in that category, not the animals in Category:Creatures. Category:Sentient species, maybe?
  2. We shouldn't have articles in a parent category and its subcategory: but an alphabetical categorization scheme for all sentient species is useful.

So, I'd suggest dividing the top category into:

I'm also against the idea of Category:Individuals by species being part of the sentient species category (whatever we call it), since it puts people in a nested subcategory of a mother category for species, which is a bit odd to me.

Some obvious problems with my scheme:

  1. We should be prepared for arguments over whether particular "Near-Humans" go in the Human races or Near-Human species category.
  2. Do subspecies/races get to stay in the alphabetical listing? What about the ones which may be species or subspecies, depending on interpretation?
  3. Are some of my second-order categories unneeded?
  4. The biological groupings are kind of arbitrary: should a Mammalian category include the rodents, felines, etc? Should all aquatic species go together?

Anyone else?—Silly Dan (talk) 02:33, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

  • Some species are too hard to tell. What are Rodians? Reptilitan? Insectoid? What about, God save us, Hutts? Havac 05:42, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
    • Dan, I'll get back to you later about this. Havac, Rodians are insectoid, Hutts are molluscan. --Imp 06:40, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
      • Alien Encounters IDs Rodians as reptiles, actually. We don't necessarily need to put all species in a biological subcat, though. —Silly Dan (talk) 11:59, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
  • Here's my opinion to further enhance the aforementioned ideas.
    • First, I was responsible for creating Category:Individuals by species and placing it in Category:Races and species, however this was only done when the system had not been expanded upon as it is now.
    • Perhaps rename Category:Creatures to Category:Non-sentient species?
    • We could keep the alphacat.
    • We will have to distinguish between sentients and non and semi-sentients so the category has to reflect that.
    • I think that one category can be Category:Sentient species by culture, and would subgroup sentients by enslavement, politics, alliances, xenophobia, e.g. Category:Xenophobic species.
    • I agree with separation by biology, which is basically the same concept we already have going, only expanded.
    • Humans are complicated as it is.
    • I do like the parent Mammalian category for those that fit in it, yet we want finding them to be easy.

-- Riffsyphon1024 23:09, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Lets not forget a rule that we should all go by: Sentience. It states

  • "A sapient is a being with the ability to think intelligently.
  • The term sentient, however, is more commonly used and has a similar meaning—a being with the capacity to feel sensations, such as pain.
  • The term sentient is applied, albeit incorrectly, to both living beings and droids who demonstrate the ability to reason.
  • Some species that can manipulate tools, language and civilization of very primitive stage, are classified as semi-sentient or semi-sapient.
  • Non-sentient species are considered beasts, though this term implies that animals are incapable of feeling pain. The correct term would be non-sapient."--ShadowTrooper 01:57, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
    • Problem being that almost every source uses "sentient" when the correct English term is "sapient". (Unless they're using "sentient" in terms of "can feel emotions", not just "sensations.") —Silly Dan (talk) 02:00, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
      • Well let's try our best to use it the proper engish way like the article says.--ShadowTrooper 02:09, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
        • On the other hand, if everyone wants to use it the "improper" way lets vote and change the article.--ShadowTrooper 02:21, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
          • And I was just wondering Are we going to put humans under mammals?--ShadowTrooper 02:29, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
            • Yes, the Human and Near-Human species category would go under mammals. As for the sapient/sentient question, that goes at Talk:Sentient or in a separate forum thread. —Silly Dan (talk) 02:31, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Just so you know Dan I agree with you on your proposal for the revamp.--ShadowTrooper 02:39, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
    • I also like Mr Dan's proposal. I'd be willing to help with the mass categorizations if its implimented. Lonnyd 10:31, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
      • Just to let you know, if you have a list of articles in which categories you want, a bot (such as Whistler) can do a majority of the work for you if you think it'll help. —Xwing328(Talk) 06:36, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new thread.